Olympus Posted June 23, 2006 Share Posted June 23, 2006 isolation is not a myth... dude naman... people have been doing isolation workouts for the better part of fitness history and have been getting reults... you can't discount that... the thing that you can say is that "isolation has already been proven to be not as efficient in getting reults as....... etc etc etc etc.... so why bother?" that is easier to accept...<{POST_SNAPBACK}> If you want me to say that so I will... Compound exercises are superior to single joint exercises any given day Quote Link to comment
Equus Posted June 23, 2006 Share Posted June 23, 2006 okay okay okay okay... ganito nalang para klaro sa mga nagbabasa... True isolation meaning an exercise that will only focus on a single muscle part... lets say the bicep femoris... is a myth. whenever you do the so called isolation work outs, you actually do use the other associated muscles to that so called "isolated" muscle part that you're trying to work out... However, i think for the purpose of clarity and simplification of terminoligies and ideologies, i feel that there is no need to break down the system that has been in use for god knows when... Ika nga, why re-invent the wheel? or why fix it if it aint broken... classic example is this... in higher animals, the bicep femoris is a fallacious term since the bicep in dogs for example has three heads instead of the usual two... now, the term was no longger changed because of its reference in terms of locale, use, etc etc... point is, why complicate things? i don't see the need to breakdown long used terminologies in the hopes of promoting your own array of terminologies no matter how scientifically sound they are... just improve nalang... kasi nga gumugulo... Quote Link to comment
Equus Posted June 23, 2006 Share Posted June 23, 2006 thanks pare.... THANK GOD FOR THE FORUMS!!!!!!! back to topic, yes... model bodied workouts should be done with more compound exercises because that is where the development of true strength lies... Quote Link to comment
JesusFreak! Posted June 23, 2006 Share Posted June 23, 2006 True dat...you defintely won't get a model body in those "sosyal" establishments. I've been a member of them as well, and most of the "model" types in those places take steroids. I've watched them train, and there's NO WAY that they could get results training the way they do naturally. I want to make it clear to the lurkers that you shouldn't be fooled by what you see in those gyms. There are a great deal of "dirty little secrets" in the mainstream modeling and fitness industry.<{POST_SNAPBACK}>Hmmm... information such as this is very helpful... it demystifies all the illusion of how really models work out. Quote Link to comment
Eclipseguy Posted June 23, 2006 Share Posted June 23, 2006 Hmmm... information such as this is very helpful... it demystifies all the illusion of how really models work out.<{POST_SNAPBACK}> We even had a guy once who wanted to compete in the Mossimo bikini summit (he came in 4 months ago). With his genetics we could have easily had him in shape in 3 months or less, and natural. He kept mentioning how his training was before and would continue to question how he could get into shape if we wouldn't give him steroids. He kept giving us the names of his trainers at his well-known gym before who were also his dealers. We kept insisting that he look around at our members and at ourselves. While he agreed with the evidence, he didn't appear to believe that it was possible for him to get into shape naturally, citing how many others he knew who were using. He didn't come back again after that day. He even admitted to someone that we both knew that our principles seemed sound, but he just couldn't accept that it could be done naturally in such a limited amount of time. I also had a meeting with a large men's magazine editor. His jaw was on the floor when I told him various stories about the male modeling industry. He was even somewhat upset that I say such sweeping statements. After I left, I was told that he asked two guys in the office who were professional models in the past. They admitted that steroids were basically a given when it came to modeling. Even one of the guys admitted to taking them recently. Needless to say that the editor was blown away...since he, like everyone else always assumed everything to be sweet and rosy. Again, it can easily be done naturally if your training and diet are sound, but don't be fooled by guys who seem to know nothing about working out yet still appear just a "little" too gifted. Quote Link to comment
Equus Posted June 23, 2006 Share Posted June 23, 2006 you really cant blame them models... they make money with the way they look... and competition can be stiff... so steroids do give you that extra edge especially in that level... Quote Link to comment
Eclipseguy Posted June 23, 2006 Share Posted June 23, 2006 you really cant blame them models... they make money with the way they look... and competition can be stiff... so steroids do give you that extra edge especially in that level...<{POST_SNAPBACK}> C'mon now...these guys who are models weigh 145lbs. When I was in college and couldn't afford to eat anything other than noodles, eggs, and peanuts and weighed 150lbs but was a ripped powerlifter, I would get cornered by everyone (even girls) who would say "tell me the truth...do you take steroids?" I was like "what the hell?!? I can barely afford food!" I just watched my diet and trained with heavy compound movements 3 days per week and did conditioning work as well. Right now I have a large number of guys who train with us who are in the same or better shape than I was then back in school. It all comes down to training. If you are a model who needs steroids to reach 145lbs lean (to achieve a look like Mossimo), then it's time to take a critical look at your training. The level of most of these guys can be achieved in 3-6 months. Their "level" is not even competitive on an international scale. Most underwear models abroad, for example, need to weigh at least 175lbs lean. Quote Link to comment
cassio Posted June 23, 2006 Share Posted June 23, 2006 you really cant blame them models... they make money with the way they look... and competition can be stiff... so steroids do give you that extra edge especially in that level...<{POST_SNAPBACK}> Unfortunately, models get hooked to steroids solely for that reason alone, to make money. Often, they end up neglecting their health. What's important to point out is that Eclipseguy is telling us that it's possible to have a model's body without resorting to bad stuff. Steroids shouldn't be a standard in the modeling industry or in any industry for that matter. Else, we'll have our future kids look up to them as role models. -cassio Quote Link to comment
Eclipseguy Posted June 23, 2006 Share Posted June 23, 2006 you really cant blame them models... they make money with the way they look... and competition can be stiff... so steroids do give you that extra edge especially in that level...<{POST_SNAPBACK}> "competition can be stiff" Another dirty (naughty) little secret of the male modeling world with respect to what happens behind the scenes? I'm in a weird mood....don't pay any attention to me Quote Link to comment
cassio Posted June 23, 2006 Share Posted June 23, 2006 "competition can be stiff" Another dirty (naughty) little secret of the male modeling world with respect to what happens behind the scenes? I'm in a weird mood....don't pay any attention to me <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Oh no!!!... -cassio Quote Link to comment
Eclipseguy Posted June 23, 2006 Share Posted June 23, 2006 isolation is not a myth... dude naman... people have been doing isolation workouts for the better part of fitness history and have been getting reults... you can't discount that... the thing that you can say is that "isolation has already been proven to be not as efficient in getting reults as....... etc etc etc etc.... so why bother?" that is easier to accept...<{POST_SNAPBACK}> Let's consider the following points: 1) Those who got "results" might be genetically gifted. 2) Those who got "results" might have also been doing heavy basic movements in addition to "isolation" movements, and it contributed far more than these "isolation" movements. Even at our gym we have guys who do our program and then scurry around at the end of their workout doing a few sets of ab work or closing curls. Even these guys know better, but habits are hard to break, as they admit. Is credit attributed to their core program or their "last second" work? As I tell new guys, usually the guys who avoid the "extra" get better results because they are less likely to overtrain. Those who witness these guys doing these extra movements might be led to believe that the "extra" helped. Again, I have guys who do extra and guys who don't. The results are nearly identical. 3) Bodybuilding magazines depend on variety, and nothing gives more variety than "isolation" movements. Otherwise low-talented writers would run out of things to discuss within 6 issues. If you've ever read strength training periodicals like Milo, you'll find it to be far more educational...but very dry, undramatic, and frankly boring if you are not looking for something specific. As I always say, you will get far more bicep development from lowering a set 5 reps with 245lb dynamic barbell bent-rows than you will ever achieve from 85lb barbell "bicep" curls. 245lbs is a common working weight for guys with 4-5 months of training. Most guys can rep 185 for 6-10 reps. Again, guys will run around messing with 25lb dumbbells after their biceps were already fried from the rows. Follow the logic and the conclusion is clear. Quote Link to comment
Olympus Posted June 24, 2006 Share Posted June 24, 2006 Forgot to mention, last week me and some of the asst. coaches were toying with the thought of how much we can curl... I managed to curl 90 lbs and I haven't done any direct bicep work in ages, except I can manage to rep 225 in dynamic bent ros and do 8 pullups with 45 lbs strapped to my waist. Quote Link to comment
JesusFreak! Posted June 24, 2006 Share Posted June 24, 2006 love of money really turns everything upside down... jst a sad realization... pero anyway, yup... at least i know dat models too take steroids, ang alam ko lang dati, only bodybuilders use them.. in this light is it safe to assume carlos agassi take steroids? mukha siya kasing bato you really cant blame them models... they make money with the way they look... and competition can be stiff... so steroids do give you that extra edge especially in that level...<{POST_SNAPBACK}> Quote Link to comment
Olympus Posted June 25, 2006 Share Posted June 25, 2006 love of money really turns everything upside down... jst a sad realization... pero anyway, yup... at least i know dat models too take steroids, ang alam ko lang dati, only bodybuilders use them.. in this light is it safe to assume carlos agassi take steroids? mukha siya kasing bato<{POST_SNAPBACK}> He does. If you guys see how he trains, it will make things even more obvious Quote Link to comment
Olympus Posted June 25, 2006 Share Posted June 25, 2006 Yup nagtake yon, obvious naman eh. Guyz ano yung part ng body nyo di pantay? or alin ang mas develop na side ng body nyo. Napansin ko lang na yung mga ibang models di talaga pantay ang muscle. I saw a picture of Ronnie Coleman at yung back muscles nya di pantay, yung isang side slightly mas malaki. Sa Wrestling napansin ko na di rin pantay ang Chest ni Chris Masters. Even Batista di rin pantay ang laki ng traps. Sa kin naman mas malaki ang Left chest ko at Left Laterals.<{POST_SNAPBACK}> No one is perfectly proportioned. This is also due to the fact that only a few people are purely ambidextrous Quote Link to comment
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