Equus Posted June 5, 2006 Share Posted June 5, 2006 im sure that experience plays a crucial role in ascertaining what is the correct thing to do... however, i still think that the true skill in any trainer lies in his or her ability to properly assess his or her clients... there are a lot of people out there who do know a lot of theories but cannot apply them correctly to the other people that they are teaching... hence the argument that a true genius is the worst teacher... In any case, i think the main point in all of this is results... The results will always be the true benchmark of success... and since the results in anything that we do physically have SO MANY VARIABLES FOR IT TO REALLY SUCCEED, its really hard to pinpoint who is right and who is wrong... We just all have to learn from this, despite the derrogatory results... quite frankly, though i find these arguments bizzarely amusing, i have learned a s@%t load of info here that i wouldn't have learned from reading a magazine... Quote Link to comment
Eclipseguy Posted June 5, 2006 Share Posted June 5, 2006 C'm dj25....I can just envision the frantic clickety-clack of the keyboard with your witty reply at the helm :cool: This is a cool board....you can see when people are replying...very nice indeed. Quote Link to comment
Equus Posted June 5, 2006 Share Posted June 5, 2006 ei eclipseguy, ill take you up on yer challenge... a friendly take up though... no competition here... just that its always goodd to have a solid goal every now and then... 3 weeks from now? Quote Link to comment
Eclipseguy Posted June 5, 2006 Share Posted June 5, 2006 im sure that experience plays a crucial role in ascertaining what is the correct thing to do... however, i still think that the true skill in any trainer lies in his or her ability to properly assess his or her clients... there are a lot of people out there who do know a lot of theories but cannot apply them correctly to the other people that they are teaching... hence the argument that a true genius is the worst teacher... In any case, i think the main point in all of this is results... The results will always be the true benchmark of success... and since the results in anything that we do physically have SO MANY VARIABLES FOR IT TO REALLY SUCCEED, its really hard to pinpoint who is right and who is wrong... We just all have to learn from this, despite the derrogatory results... quite frankly, though i find these arguments bizzarely amusing, i have learned a s@%t load of info here that i wouldn't have learned from reading a magazine...<{POST_SNAPBACK}> This is so true...and it's where experience is everything. The problem with PT's is that their so-called "gym-based education" leaves them extraordinarily closed minded. It is the average gym-goer who suffers as a result. If physical therapists were such great personal trainers, gyms would be booming. As director of Eclipse, I can tell you with 100% certainty that feedback that I hear about physcial therapists from their past clients who are now my members is resoundly negative. Physical therapists turn into personal trainers because they can't get jobs in therapy clinics. I'm not making fun of this, believe it or not. They took it up years ago thinking that they'd get a job abroad, yet now they wallow in the fitness industry, for reasons I'll never understand seeing as how their education has nothing to do with sports science.. Let's hope the same thing doesn't happen to all of the nursing students. Quote Link to comment
Eclipseguy Posted June 5, 2006 Share Posted June 5, 2006 ei eclipseguy, ill take you up on yer challenge... a friendly take up though... no competition here... just that its always goodd to have a solid goal every now and then... 3 weeks from now?<{POST_SNAPBACK}> Sure thing bro...let's do it It's an excuse for me to do HIIT like I should be doing anyway. The strength part is down pat...the conditioning part has been crap while we are opening EGI Quote Link to comment
Equus Posted June 5, 2006 Share Posted June 5, 2006 thats a weird thing that you say... cause i have seen this happen before... i used to see a sports doctor for my problems... Dr. Noel Bate.. Funny thing is that he was not a sports therapist, he was a sprts doctor... I think the distinction has to be made.. In defense to physical therapists, i think the best thing that they can do for you is pain management... that is a very important aspect in any form of medicine so therefore should not be taken lightly... But i do agree that sports therapists will be at a loss when muscle start to go on a level of hypertrophy... It is true that the body will still fall inside certain laws and principles of physiology and kinesiology but there are other aspects in the human body that becomes very variable... for example... there are some studies that show the best athletes are not the ones who are necessarily the strongest or the quickest or the best genes etc... the best athletes are the ones who can take the most amount of pain... You can be sooooo genetically gifted but if you cant take the pain... never will really get anywhere... tolerance for pain is also a very abstract characteristic... some people can argue that pain tolerance can be directly rated to the ability of the body to send neural impulses and that some people are just not as CNS sensitive... but others will say that this is a measure of discipline and mental conditioning... and that tolerance for pain is achieved from sheer force of will... we will never really know will we... Quote Link to comment
Olympus Posted June 5, 2006 Share Posted June 5, 2006 And if you are a woman, I'll put you up against the Men's Health Challenge winner, Coach Elaine. Even I wouldn't want to go head-to-head with her if we had (and we would) to handicap bodymass. At 105lbs, she's stronger than 98% of the guys at Eclipse.<{POST_SNAPBACK}> Even I wouldn't wanna go head to head with her... She totally pawns most if not all guys in any gym Quote Link to comment
Eclipseguy Posted June 5, 2006 Share Posted June 5, 2006 thats a weird thing that you say... cause i have seen this happen before... i used to see a sports doctor for my problems... Dr. Noel Bate.. Funny thing is that he was not a sports therapist, he was a sprts doctor... I think the distinction has to be made.. In defense to physical therapists, i think the best thing that they can do for you is pain management... that is a very important aspect in any form of medicine so therefore should not be taken lightly... But i do agree that sports therapists will be at a loss when muscle start to go on a level of hypertrophy... It is true that the body will still fall inside certain laws and principles of physiology and kinesiology but there are other aspects in the human body that becomes very variable... for example... there are some studies that show the best athletes are not the ones who are necessarily the strongest or the quickest or the best genes etc... the best athletes are the ones who can take the most amount of pain... You can be sooooo genetically gifted but if you cant take the pain... never will really get anywhere... tolerance for pain is also a very abstract characteristic... some people can argue that pain tolerance can be directly rated to the ability of the body to send neural impulses and that some people are just not as CNS sensitive... but others will say that this is a measure of discipline and mental conditioning... and that tolerance for pain is achieved from sheer force of will... we will never really know will we...<{POST_SNAPBACK}> We might know someday. The Russians knew tons of things that we are still translating to this day. Olympus and myself spend a great deal of time pouring over Russian training literature that has been translated by various sports scientists who defected to the West. Sports and conditioning really is a science...and a discipline completely unrelated to pain management....unless you are talking about overtraining. I'm pretty sure overtraining wasn't covered in PT. Quote Link to comment
Olympus Posted June 5, 2006 Share Posted June 5, 2006 thats a weird thing that you say... cause i have seen this happen before... i used to see a sports doctor for my problems... Dr. Noel Bate.. Funny thing is that he was not a sports therapist, he was a sprts doctor... I think the distinction has to be made.. In defense to physical therapists, i think the best thing that they can do for you is pain management... that is a very important aspect in any form of medicine so therefore should not be taken lightly... But i do agree that sports therapists will be at a loss when muscle start to go on a level of hypertrophy... It is true that the body will still fall inside certain laws and principles of physiology and kinesiology but there are other aspects in the human body that becomes very variable... for example... there are some studies that show the best athletes are not the ones who are necessarily the strongest or the quickest or the best genes etc... the best athletes are the ones who can take the most amount of pain... You can be sooooo genetically gifted but if you cant take the pain... never will really get anywhere... tolerance for pain is also a very abstract characteristic... some people can argue that pain tolerance can be directly rated to the ability of the body to send neural impulses and that some people are just not as CNS sensitive... but others will say that this is a measure of discipline and mental conditioning... and that tolerance for pain is achieved from sheer force of will... we will never really know will we...<{POST_SNAPBACK}> I think some guys who can zone in and have tunnel vision are also gifted since they most likely will be able to withstand the pain Quote Link to comment
dj25 Posted June 5, 2006 Share Posted June 5, 2006 As a biochemistry major, I know it as well....seeing as how biochem is harder than PT, you know what you can lick. Making an assumption about my intelligence is pathetic to say the least. I argue based on facts...and the facts are that you know very little about being an athlete or the way the body really works. Yah right biochem is harder than PT. give me a break. if your argument is based on facts, well check your facts again. i also based my argument on what i have learned and experienced. i don't give advice to somebody and tell them to stick to it. it's up to them if they want to hear me out or not. Ask Olympus....he knows the guy also. Plus he came from Fitness First, a place fully off doofus PTs that talked down to him like a child. I'm suprised that he didn't put your ilk over his knee and spank you. I would have if I was him. The PT's there, from his own words, were CLUELESS as how to help him. i guess the PT's your are referring to are those who do not have any gym experience at all. do not compare me to them. i know what i'm saying. Uh...genius...we are talking about the GYM...not a rehab clinic where YOU'D ACTUALLY SEE STROKE PATIENTS. Are you for real?!? i hope you trackback your post. you said that you rehabilitate a 71 y/o with almost zero mobility. i know that topic is all about the gym. i'm just giving some example. why, haven't you had a stroke patient in your gym. well, i guess if someone approached you with this condition you will be entirely clueless how to deal with his case. don't you know that even PT's in the states require their patient to go to the gym to further increase their strength. No...because it was incredibly freakin' boring and had NOTHING TO DO with a gymnasium environment. I DO NOT enjoy working with stroke patients...so I chose not to do so. And you are WRONG. The biceps DOES NOT flex the arm. Read Muscles Alive. It should be required reading for a PT if it is not...or maybe you can't retain what you read. Oops...I made an assumption. I was kidding about the last thing about what you might or might not have done. :thumbsupsmiley: read my post again. i'm the one asking you the action of your biceps and explain to me why it is so? the biceps does not flex the arm? i thought your answer is based on faqs. In what literature did you encounter this one. maybe your the one who could not retain or understand what you read. Crunches are a waste of time unless you are using heavy weights. Muscle biopsies of abdominal muscles confims that they are fast twitch muscle fibers, meaning they respond to heavy weights and low reps. Doing weightless crunches will cause a plateau in 4-6 weeks. Where is my explanation wrong? Tell me so I can decisively shred your pointless arguments even further. Genetics? I was 5'10" and 115lbs when I begain training. It took me 4 YEARS to get past 130lbs. Now I'm 179 16 years later because I know what the hell I'm doing. Let's compare guys I've trained to guys you've trained....and girls too. Better yet, let's have them do a drug test. Mine will be the first to line up to take it. i hope you improve your explanation as well as your grammar. it took you 4 years, man your program that time is not good. you should check your faqs again Did you even READ...or possibly UNDERSTAND what I even wrote? Your reply is complete nonsense and gibberish that is completely unrelated to what was my point. You're a fun guy...really i think we're both funny guys here. i hope you read your own post. if my reply is nonsense that is because the person i'm replying is a nonsene person. well better not to reply again. i don't want to be qouted same birds with the same feathers flock together. If you want to accept my challenge, meet me at Eclipse in the next 3 weeks when I'll be available to embarrass cocky board members. i admit that you must be bigger and stronger than me but i will not step down on your level. i hope you react in a professional way or are you? Quote Link to comment
Equus Posted June 5, 2006 Share Posted June 5, 2006 hehehehehehe... havent had the chance to tabata method yet... probably when i lose my job an decide to take a gun to my head, i will do tabata method as a form of masochism... hehehehehehhe true true.. white zone... described as the ability of some bikers have to bolt away from the pack at the crucial moment... and i beg to disagree though.. i get tunnel vision a lot and i am still far from being the athlete that i want to be... wait a minute, i think the tunnel vision was from too much "recreational" pharmaceuticals... Quote Link to comment
Olympus Posted June 5, 2006 Share Posted June 5, 2006 We might know someday. The Russians knew tons of things that we are still translating to this day. Olympus and myself spend a great deal of time pouring over Russian training literature that has been translated by various sports scientists who defected to the West. Sports and conditioning really is a science...and a discipline completely unrelated to pain management....unless you are talking about overtraining. I'm pretty sure overtraining wasn't covered in PT. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> And to think we've only started learning how to properly use linear and conjugate periodization.... I wonder what will happen once we master the art of the oscillating wave and undulating periodization? The Russians were ahead of their time in terms of sports science, and to think some of thier old stuff is still undiscovered by many today Quote Link to comment
Equus Posted June 5, 2006 Share Posted June 5, 2006 and look where they are now... where are they now? hmmmmm... Quote Link to comment
Olympus Posted June 5, 2006 Share Posted June 5, 2006 and look where they are now... where are they now? hmmmmm...<{POST_SNAPBACK}> well, we can't tke away the fact that the Soviet Union disbanded and that communism isn't as rampant as it used to be. Yet, many Russians, Ukranians, Belarusians, Lithuanians, Georgians and Armenians are still winning in their respective sports Quote Link to comment
Equus Posted June 5, 2006 Share Posted June 5, 2006 point of fact.. there really was no communism to speak of... even at the height of russian power.. at best it was an extreme socialist country... hehehehehhehehe.. lalang... 3 weeks... i will have to brush up on my running... good excuse to run more and do better hiit... Quote Link to comment
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