Propose A Law

[dragonei]

I am just reminded of something told to me by a wise man, "when the right to speak out is curtailed, freedom of speech is dead." I agree that the roads are for the people, and I hate it when rallies block the roads, still, all-in-all, the people protesting are still citizenry, and thus have the right to use the road. I will still hate what they are doing, but it IS their right.

 

But, yeah, I really want to agree with you there.

 

Well right to speak yes. Im not questioning the right to say what they want. The manner though the one in question. Pero wala silang karapatang humarang sa kalsada ng basta na lang

 

If it was absolute then we wont need laws against libel and defamation now would we.

[moichi]

Well right to speak yes. Im not questioning the right to say what they want. The manner though the one in question. Pero wala silang karapatang humarang sa kalsada ng basta na lang

 

If it was absolute then we wont need laws against libel and defamation now would we.

 

maiinis ka nga talaga pag nakaharang sila,

however that's their right,

just like in any parade, or santacruzan, or prusisyon...

 

the job of keeping the streets passable is that of the police...

so when roads are blocked, its not the rallyists but the cops who should be blamed for not doing their jobs.

[dragonei]

maiinis ka nga talaga pag nakaharang sila,

however that's their right,

just like in any parade, or santacruzan, or prusisyon...

 

the job of keeping the streets passable is that of the police...

so when roads are blocked, its not the rallyists but the cops who should be blamed for not doing their jobs.

 

Well if thats your point, then napakaselfish naman nyan.

 

Well heres the deal.

 

1.) para saan ba kalsada? Di ba daanan ng sasakyan? Pano kung ambulansya ang di makadaan at namatay pasyente? Pwede mo ba sabihin na mas me karapatan kang maghayag ng saloobin mo sa pasyente na gusto mabuhay?

 

2.) Police? Well if thats your argument then with more reason we should have laws to police them. In the first place Di ka pwede mag sta. cruzan o parada ng walang kaukulang permit. At supervised yan ng mga pulis at nabibigay yan sila ng traffic advisory at least a day ahead. Eh ang mga ralliyista gusto na lang bumulga dyan sa daan ng hindi inaasahan

 

3.) In the first place, sumusunod ba sa mga pulis yang mga ralliyistang yan? Nakaranas na po ako sumali sa mga ilang kilos protesta. And I will tell you, this, ralliyista ang laging naguumpisa ng gulo hindi ang pulis. Riot police are ordered to use defensive routines and are ordered to pacify demonstrators in such a way that will minimize the use of offensive attacks. Demonstrators on the other hand are unruly, uncivilized and violent. Kakatawa nga eh, nung yung riot police na napilyan nagreklamo sa commission on human rights, pinagtawanan pa siya ng mga commissioners

 

4.) Kung simpleng photo shoot nga lang sa kalsada kelangan ng permit, rally pa kaya?

 

5.) No citizen has the right to cause obstruction on the streets, moreso inhibit anybody to exercise their own right not to be an obstruction. And if inevitably you will cause such, securing a permit is the least responsible thing to do.

 

Sa japan me demostrators din. Pero regulated. Me oras lang at espasyo na binibigay. At pagkatapos obligado silang ligpitin kalat nila. Eh dito? Maninira pa ng public at private property magvavandalize pa. At pag kinasuhan mo, gagamitin pang dahilan ang bill of rights. Well we have other laws than those provided in the bill of rights :thumbsdownsmiley:

 

At sa mga rallyista, maghanap nga kayo ng trabaho! Kung me trabaho kayo di kayo magraralyy kasi sayang ang bawas sa sweldo pag absent kayo

[Waterbearer]

Or remove vehicles that are 10 years or older from the streets and reduce the price of vehicles, that way, supposedly the new cars are more 'fuel efficient' and 'less polluting', ergo cleaner and roomier roads.

I guess so…..but thinking further I realized traffic is proportional to the number of cars on the streets. We can't do anything about the positioning of roads and highways coz' that's how its gonna be otherwise it will be costly……we can only contain the quantity of the vehicles. We reduce the numbers, we reduce traffic….numbers can't only comprise of old cars but brand new cars as well….some people just got enough money to buy more that 3 brand new cars for each of their children and it will still clog our streets….so I revert back to my original position.

 

I take it you ain't a smoker? Well if we are going to stop people from having the simple things that please them, we should expand it, raise the taxes equally. Although increasing the punishment for all crimes would be nice.

On the contrary, I am. I hope this would give me the opportunity to lead by example.

 

There have been existing laws for crimes related to these and they still don't learn….that's why I think that the best way to stop these vices is to not make them affordable.

 

 

And where are we going to get paper (of all sorts)? Recycling uses more energy than making new products, and importing the raw paper pulp is just ridiculous, controlled logging and forced replanting just may be the ticket.

 

I think this is an issue of what to prioritize…..With technology on the rise, I wouldn't mind having a paper crisis in my term if it would mean enough time for those trees to mature and thereby save a lot of lives in the future….Lack of paper can't take away lives…..but the lack of trees can.

So, we should ban ALL vehicle importation? After all Sarao makes vehicles locally. Oh, no more imported clothes and food since we can make those here as well. I don't see how that would work.

Hahaha….got me on that one…..Sarao is a jeepney, not a sedan or a 4wd or a muscle car…..i don't see any problem with that.

 

Here's the problem with colonial mentality….we got so brainwashed with imports we forgot we can make the same thing if we set our mind into it….Look at China….Taiwan….we criticize them for pirating things but guess who has the last laugh in revenues…..its them….they even went to the point that they were like almost encouraging piracy. During Marshall Law, there was a scarcity of imported goods….Apples and imported chocolates….even US canned goods were a luxury back then…..but somehow the Filipinos survived….

 

It's all mindset. Its' ridiculous to protest or walk down the streets just because you can't consume imported products like the way you used to.

[moichi]

Well if thats your point, then napakaselfish naman nyan.

 

not quite.

it's a right. inalienable as anybody else's.

it's in the exercise and the regulation that this right is misunderstood.

 

Well heres the deal.

 

1.) para saan ba kalsada? Di ba daanan ng sasakyan? Pano kung ambulansya ang di makadaan at namatay pasyente? Pwede mo ba sabihin na mas me karapatan kang maghayag ng saloobin mo sa pasyente na gusto mabuhay?

 

ang kalsada ay daanan. tama yan. pero di lang sasakyan ang pwede gumamit niyan. pwede karitela, biskleta at ang iyong pedestrian, kung marami sila.

 

now as far as the ambulansya, i have not heard of any that died kasi hinarang ng rallyista. most people (and rallyists) have the decency to let an ambulance pass.

 

 

2.) Police? Well if thats your argument then with more reason we should have laws to police them. In the first place Di ka pwede mag sta. cruzan o parada ng walang kaukulang permit. At supervised yan ng mga pulis at nabibigay yan sila ng traffic advisory at least a day ahead. Eh ang mga ralliyista gusto na lang bumulga dyan sa daan ng hindi inaasahan

[

 

b]

the police are there to ensure that traffic flows. nandun sila para siguruhing nasa ayos ang lahat. kung minsan nga escort pa sila. (remember ninoy? fpj?)

 

now as to the issuance of permits, the city or municipality has no right to deny anyone a permit, since this is a basic right, guaranteed by the constitution itself. unless it is proven that it is not feasible to do so, the city can only regulate the issuance so that groups don't do it simultaneously. so its a scheduling matter. (unless of course these are traditional events like the may 1 rallies).

 

now this is where it gets sticky because of political leanings. what happens is that pro-govt will always get permits. anti-govt will almost always get no permit. can you blame them kung bumulaga sila one day when they schedule 30 days or 3 months ahead and a permit is denied them? it's like denying your right to fart in public.[/b]

 

3.) In the first place, sumusunod ba sa mga pulis yang mga ralliyistang yan? Nakaranas na po ako sumali sa mga ilang kilos protesta. And I will tell you, this, ralliyista ang laging naguumpisa ng gulo hindi ang pulis. Riot police are ordered to use defensive routines and are ordered to pacify demonstrators in such a way that will minimize the use of offensive attacks. Demonstrators on the other hand are unruly, uncivilized and violent. Kakatawa nga eh, nung yung riot police na napilyan nagreklamo sa commission on human rights, pinagtawanan pa siya ng mga commissioners

 

this is not as simple as it looks.

 

yun din bang mga pulis eh sumusunod sa regulasyon? may permit ka na nga at lahat, tapos ayaw ka pag-assemble-in sa lugar mo? sino naman matutuwa nun.

 

as far as defensive routines, maybe you weren't there before edsa 1, during the dark days of martial law. police aren't there for defensive postures, they're there to break up rallies, inflict pain and as much damage as they can with maximum tolerance.

 

is it any different now?

 

4.) Kung simpleng photo shoot nga lang sa kalsada kelangan ng permit, rally pa kaya?

 

5.) No citizen has the right to cause obstruction on the streets, moreso inhibit anybody to exercise their own right not to be an obstruction. And if inevitably you will cause such, securing a permit is the least responsible thing to do.

 

Sa japan me demostrators din. Pero regulated. Me oras lang at espasyo na binibigay. At pagkatapos obligado silang ligpitin kalat nila. Eh dito? Maninira pa ng public at private property magvavandalize pa. At pag kinasuhan mo, gagamitin pang dahilan ang bill of rights. Well we have other laws than those provided in the bill of rights :thumbsdownsmiley:

 

At sa mga rallyista, maghanap nga kayo ng trabaho! Kung me trabaho kayo di kayo magraralyy kasi sayang ang bawas sa sweldo pag absent kayo

 

that's what they said when marcos was in power. and yet....

that's what they said when erap was in power. and yet...

 

and now, kung may trabaho ba, is it guaranteed that they won't take to the streets?

 

as long as there are legitimate grievances, and legitimate venues are denied them to air these grievances, rallies will always be the favored venue to do so.

 

perhaps what is needed is to give these people the understanding they want at the very least, or the justice that they seek, if at all.

[moichi]

at para di ot,

 

i propose a law that a cabinet member will have as part of his duties to be present in a rally. to receive for and in behalf of govt whatever the rallyists are demanding. whether it is for gma to resign, to have garci castrated, or to raise hemlines and lower necklines, whatever.

 

this way, there is an exchange of the communiques. pag tanggap na ang demand, there could be no rally of that sort for at least 30 days.

[BnF95]

I guess so…..but thinking further I realized traffic is proportional to the number of cars on the streets. We can't do anything about the positioning of roads and highways coz' that's how its gonna be otherwise it will be costly……we can only contain the quantity of the vehicles. We reduce the numbers, we reduce traffic….numbers can't only comprise of old cars but brand new cars as well….some people just got enough money to buy more that 3 brand new cars for each of their children and it will still clog our streets….so I revert back to my original position.

Perhaps a graded increase in taxes? 50% for the first vehicle, 100% for the second, 200% for the third, 400% for the fourth, etc. etc.? Just for comparison, our current taxes on vehicles is somewhere between 100% to 200% at this time. This way, 'poorer' people can afford one or two cars, but after that ... it becomes progressively more expensive.

 

On the contrary, I am. I hope this would give me the opportunity to lead by example.

 

There have been existing laws for crimes related to these and they still don't learn….that's why I think that the best way to stop these vices is to not make them affordable.

Cigarettes cause crime???

 

I think this is an issue of what to prioritize…..With technology on the rise, I wouldn't mind having a paper crisis in my term if it would mean enough time for those trees to mature and thereby save a lot of lives in the future….Lack of paper can't take away lives…..but the lack of trees can.

Fair enough, I never did like too much paperwork anyway.

 

Hahaha….got me on that one…..Sarao is a jeepney, not a sedan or a 4wd or a muscle car…..i don't see any problem with that.

A vehicle is a vehicle is a vehicle. Its main purpose is to take people from point a to point b.

 

Here's the problem with colonial mentality….we got so brainwashed with imports we forgot we can make the same thing if we set our mind into it….Look at China….Taiwan….we criticize them for pirating things but guess who has the last laugh in revenues…..its them….they even went to the point that they were like almost encouraging piracy. During Marshall Law, there was a scarcity of imported goods….Apples and imported chocolates….even US canned goods were a luxury back then…..but somehow the Filipinos survived….

 

It's all mindset. Its' ridiculous to protest or walk down the streets just because you can't consume imported products like the way you used to.

About the only 'imported' product I normally purchase would be books, so if we really are going into this whole 'tree-hugger' type mentality, I suppose I'd have to be satisfied with purchasing it in electronic format.

 

at para di ot,

 

i propose a law that a cabinet member will have as part of his duties to be present in a rally. to receive for and in behalf of govt whatever the rallyists are demanding. whether it is for gma to resign, to have garci castrated, or to raise hemlines and lower necklines, whatever.

 

this way, there is an exchange of the communiques. pag tanggap na ang demand, there could be no rally of that sort for at least 30 days.

Castration? Hahahaha, oh my, that was so funny. I do like the concept though. Perhaps even make it mandatory for elected officials to hold an 'audience' with their constituents, sort of a 'question hour', even if only once a week.

[dragonei]

Well paulit ulit ko ng nabasa ang saligang batas. At ilang beses na rin akong pumirma sa kasunduan na ipagtatangol ko ang saligang batas. Pero kahit minsan wala akong nakitang salita doon na nagsasabi that your freedom of expression includes usage of any means you want to. Moreso that any liability in such exercise is waived just because you have freedom of expression.

 

In as much as you have the right to speak, you should also respect the right of the other people not to listen to you, not to be disturbed, and not to be obstructed.

 

Someones right to air his grievances is equally important as someones right to be on time for his movie date. And no jackass rallyist has the right to prevent me from having my rights to. Isn't it an Irony while somebody fights for rights, that same person belittles or infacts show no respect for the rights of the other people around him.

 

So ano ngayon katwiran mo? Di pa naman nahaharangan ng ralliysta ambulnsya kaya ok lang maging irresponsable sila sa daan? Dude in the first place kung me malasakit talaga ang ilan sa kanila, sana naiisip nila yan in the first place. O kaya maisip mo man lang na yung isang taong malalate sa trabaho dahil sa iyo ay pwedeng mabawasan ng sweldo. Sweldo sana na ipangbabayad nya ng tuition ng anak nya. But no! rallyist care nothing more but their selfish ideologies.

 

This is not the martial law era. Ang hirap kasi nung nasanay na ang tao sa kalsada dun ng dun na lang. Konting git git rally na agad. Dude like I said I have been in several rallies at lkaging milatante ang naguumpisa ng gulo. Its not the irregularity of the permit that becomes the problem but the problem is that Rallyist exceed beyond the terms and conditions of the permit. At pag sinaway sila pa nagagalit. Pero ang media finofocus lang ang mga camera nila sa mga napapalo ng mga pasaway na rallyista. Paano yung isang pulis na nabalda nuong pro-FPJ rally? Me pamilya din siyang binubuhay.

 

Im not saying that permits should be issued depending on its purpose. Like I said your right to air your grievances is equal to my right to be on time for my date. But what am saying is that rallyist should learn to practice responisbility and in order to ensure this, rules and laws will be needed. I.e. they should be alloted a given time and venue which they should never exceed. The venue should not be a distraction and obstruction to innocent nearby establishments i.e. hospitals, schools, and churches. Rallyisit should not litter moreso vandalize any walls and destroy any public or private properties.

 

Ang hirap nyan, tayo pang private citizens mismo maglilinis pa ng mga kababuyan nila pagkatapos.

[amante]

On the criminal justice system:

 

You eat what you k*ll

[BnF95]

On the criminal justice system:

 

You eat what you k*ll

*gasp* :sick: What if one were to k*ll cockroaches or rats? I say no, unless it were amended to read: If one kills a human being, one must eat that flesh (regardless of the time spent between the murder and the meal).

 

But then, wouldn't the families of the deceased have objections to this?

[moichi]

Im not saying that permits should be issued depending on its purpose. Like I said your right to air your grievances is equal to my right to be on time for my date. But what am saying is that rallyist should learn to practice responisbility and in order to ensure this, rules and laws will be needed. I.e. they should be alloted a given time and venue which they should never exceed. The venue should not be a distraction and obstruction to innocent nearby establishments i.e. hospitals, schools, and churches. Rallyisit should not litter moreso vandalize any walls and destroy any public or private properties.

 

Ang hirap nyan, tayo pang private citizens mismo maglilinis pa ng mga kababuyan nila pagkatapos.

 

agreed. responsibility is the key.

[federicuger]

illegalize na ang corruption para pwede i-regulate

[BnF95]

illegalize na ang corruption para pwede i-regulate

Corruption IS illegal, how does one regulate it? If corruption were legal, then it stands to reason that it wouldn't be called corruption anymore, rather it would be grifting or gift-giving.

[tom_babauta]

corruption wont be illegal if its legalized, politicians would agree with me

[capybarra]

this has been proposed before, but I really feel we should change the name of our country.

think about it for a minute. if I were a foreigner and asked you why is your country named

the Philippines, will you be puff up your chest and proudly declare, "we are named after a Spanish king!"

...who by the way never came and set foot here

...who probably didn't give sh*t about it unless it was about how much gold it could get and send back

...whose descendants by and large do not know this country of brown men was once under its brutal reign

 

but...if that would become reality, what name would we replace it with?

yun ang tanong...