South China/West Philippine Sea

[mata_hari]

Let's set aside all the talk about being unpatriotic and a coward and talk about reality.

 

In one of the coup attempts versus the Cory gov't, a group of mutinous marines gathered around the Libis area to launch an attack on Camp Aguinaldo. A Sikorsky helicopter flown by loyalist airmen was monitoring their movement from above. Shots were fired at the helicopter by the rebel forces forcing the Sikorssy to fly out of harms way. Then a few minutes later two US Navy F4 Phantom fighter planes flew low as in very low where the marines were positioned. They flew in such a way that the marines below will clearly see the wide array of bombs and rockets strapped under the wings of the F4. Ang tawag dun a "persuasion flight". Then a young marine 2nd Lt spoke over the radio courtesy of a usiserong media man. The marine officer sounded very tense and he said. "Ayan po bobombahin na po kami dito, kung pwede po sana mag people power po sana kayo para huwag kaming mabomba". Those who heard this burst into laughter. A few more minutes the marines broke ranks and left the area and the coup attempt ended in a failure.

 

Now what if China would not be diplomatic about the Spratlys and instead send not just a flight of 2 but a squadron of MIG fighter planes over the Spratly in a "persuasion flight" formation, what would you expect the Pinoy soldiers do?? Dead heroes maybe.

[jopoc]

 

I answered your question regarding the mutual defense treaty. If we get attacked by China and the US adheres to the treaty, we will fight side by side with the Americans.

 

Can we do anything if the Chinese annex our region of the Spratlys? Again, if we so decide to go to war with China over the Spratlys alone and not with the USA, the AFP is gonna get a decimation of epic proportions.

 

 

see how inconsistent you are....

 

without the americans....we dont fight because we have nothing to use against them.

 

with the american, we fight.... but what will we use to fight the chinese? do you honestly think the americans will let the filipinos operate their battleships or let the filipinos fly their fighter jets?

 

 

 

 

But if I were you, I'd practice on grovelling while crawling on my knees trying to surrender so they would take pity and not k*ll me.

 

 

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA.......

[Guest inverbrass]

see how inconsistent you are....

 

without the americans....we dont fight because we have nothing to use against them.

 

with the american, we fight.... but what will we use to fight the chinese? do you honestly think the americans will let the filipinos operate their battleships or let the filipinos fly their fighter jets?

Inconsistent? How am I inconsistent?

 

Exactly. Obviously, we will fight side by side with the Americans. How would we fight the Chinese alone with much inferior military resources?

 

Did I even imply that the Americans will let Filipinos operate their battleships and fly their fighter jets?

 

Let's set aside all the talk about being unpatriotic and a coward and talk about reality.

 

In one of the coup attempts versus the Cory gov't, a group of mutinous marines gathered around the Libis area to launch an attack on Camp Aguinaldo. A Sikorsky helicopter flown by loyalist airmen was monitoring their movement from above. Shots were fired at the helicopter by the rebel forces forcing the Sikorssy to fly out of harms way. Then a few minutes later two US Navy F4 Phantom fighter planes flew low as in very low where the marines were positioned. They flew in such a way that the marines below will clearly see the wide array of bombs and rockets strapped under the wings of the F4. Ang tawag dun a "persuasion flight". Then a young marine 2nd Lt spoke over the radio courtesy of a usiserong media man. The marine officer sounded very tense and he said. "Ayan po bobombahin na po kami dito, kung pwede po sana mag people power po sana kayo para huwag kaming mabomba". Those who heard this burst into laughter. A few more minutes the marines broke ranks and left the area and the coup attempt ended in a failure.

 

Now what if China would not be diplomatic about the Spratlys and instead send not just a flight of 2 but a squadron of MIG fighter planes over the Spratly in a "persuasion flight" formation, what would you expect the Pinoy soldiers do?? Dead heroes maybe.

Natawa ako dito. I wonder if two posters here would still be preaching bravado if they were sent to the Spratlys (granting they reach it) and were given flybys by Chinese MIGS threatening to bomb them.

Edited July 16, 2011 by TheSmilingBandit

[KareemJabbar]

Natawa ako dito. I wonder if two posters here would still be preaching bravado if they were sent to the Spratlys (granting they reach it) and were given flybys by Chinese MIGS threatening to bomb them.

 

But we have anti-aircraft guns, takenote guns and not SAM's. I just dont know if it can shoot down modern planes like MIG's and SU-27's.

 

 

Here is China's Air force Strength.

 

Force Size

Strength: 400,000

 

 

Aircraft

Bomber/attack: 600

Fighter: 1,300

AWACS: 4

Large transport: 80

Tanker: 10

Special mission: 30

 

 

Surface-to-Air Missile

Manpower: 210,000

SAM launcher: 500

AA gun: 16,000

Airborne Force

Manpower: 24,000

 

 

and here is our only Air Defense weapons.

 

http://i52.tinypic.com/waq8uv.jpg

http://i52.tinypic.com/104jhcj.jpg

http://i55.tinypic.com/ru91dc.jpg

http://i55.tinypic.com/2jz5m9.jpg

http://i56.tinypic.com/2cfefcx.jpg

http://i56.tinypic.com/2hwznkn.jpg

http://i54.tinypic.com/2jaayk5.jpg

 

 

 

[jopoc]

Inconsistent? How am I inconsistent?

 

Exactly. Obviously, we will fight side by side with the Americans. How would we fight the Chinese alone with much inferior military resources?

 

Did I even imply that the Americans will let Filipinos operate their battleships and fly their fighter jets?

 

 

what will we use in fighting the chinese, assuming the american will fight with us?

[camiar]

Natawa ako dito. I wonder if two posters here would still be preaching bravado if they were sent to the Spratlys (granting they reach it) and were given flybys by Chinese MIGS threatening to bomb them.

 

If I'm ever sent to the Spratlys, I would do so without complaint. It would be my duty as a Filipino.

 

I'm appalled to see so many of you here with the same "resistance is futile" mindset, and even be so shameless in denigrating your own country in the internet.

 

If you read my post carefully, I was not preaching bravado. I am preaching quiet, dignified resistance. We may be weaker militarily, but we should behave with quiet resolve in the face of Chinese's calculated aggression in the Spratlys. We know anyway that they wouldn't attack -- they are just testing how far they can pressure us. We also know that we have our ASEAN neighbors and US Mutual Defense Treaty to go back on if ever the Chinese would be so stupid to go to a shooting war with us. We should react calmly, quietly and with dignity.

 

What you do instead is humiliate yourself by bawling out and wailing how weak we are and how futile it is to stand up to the all powerful Chinese.

 

I would understand if you're a pro-China Fil-Chi. But if you are a full blooded Filipino with that kind of loser mentality, I have no words to describe you.

 

To give people here a perspective of what is at stake, look at the pictures below:

 

 

See how close the Spratlys are to the Philippines and how far away China is.

 

 

Kalayaan Island viewed from 1.5 km elevation.

 

 

Chinese military outpost South of Kalayaan Island viewed from 1.5 km elevation.

Edited July 16, 2011 by TheSmilingBandit

[artvader]

Look at that: the Chinese outpost looks like a gun aimed at the Kalayaan Island. Is it a subliminal message?

[jopoc]

Look at that: the Chinese outpost looks like a gun aimed at the Kalayaan Island. Is it a subliminal message?

 

probably the reason why some posters are freaking scared of the chinese..... subliminal message sent and received.

[Guest inverbrass]

what will we use in fighting the chinese, assuming the american will fight with us?

We'll use the same military resources that are with us just to have a semblance of a navy/army fighting the Chinese. We will have the most powerful ally in the world in terms of military strength fighting side by side with us so we won't have to worry about the Chinese subs sinking our transport ships and Chinese MIGS blowing our transport planes out of the sky. In my opinion, two carrier battle groups in the vicinity of the Spratlys would be enough to make China think twice.

Edited July 17, 2011 by inverbrass

[Guest inverbrass]

If I'm ever sent to the Spratlys, I would do so without complaint. It would be my duty as a Filipino.

 

I'm appalled to see so many of you here with the same "resistance is futile" mindset, and even be so shameless in denigrating your own country in the internet.

 

If you read my post carefully, I was not preaching bravado. I am preaching quiet, dignified resistance. We may be weaker militarily, but we should behave with quiet resolve in the face of Chinese's calculated aggression in the Spratlys. We know anyway that they wouldn't attack -- they are just testing how far they can pressure us. We also know that we have our ASEAN neighbors and US Mutual Defense Treaty to go back on if ever the Chinese would be so stupid to go to a shooting war with us. We should react calmly, quietly and with dignity.

 

What you do instead is humiliate yourself by bawling out and wailing how weak we are and how futile it is to stand up to the all powerful Chinese.

 

I would understand if you're a pro-China Fil-Chi. But if you are a full blooded Filipino with that kind of loser mentality, I have no words to describe you.

 

Haha! Loser mentality you say? I'm just being realistic unlike you who lives in his dreamworld saying we should put up a quiet, dignified resistance. So tell me, how can we match word with deed when you say that we should put up a quiet, dignified resistance while the Chinese are bombing the Spratlys and the US somehow reneges on its mutual defense treaty with us?

 

So you're talking tough knowing that there is a Mutual Defense Treaty with the US and our ASEAN neighbors to back us up. I was talking about a scenario wherein we would battle the Chinese by ourselves. I wonder if you would still be talking tough if we were to go toe to toe with the Chinese by ourselves and you were a soldier assigned to the Spratlys and Chinese MIGS are doing flybys threatening to bomb you to kingdom come. Wasn't it you who posted this? "There are lots of ways we can deter China from using its military advantage to take over the Kalayaan Island. One way is to grovel submissively to the Chinese." I wouldn't be surprised if you did this while the Chinese are hovering above with their MIGS .

 

 

 

 

 

[jopoc]

We'll use the same military resources that are with us just to have a semblance of a navy/army fighting the Chinese. We will have the most powerful ally in the world in terms of military strength fighting side by side with us so we won't have to worry about the Chinese subs sinking our transport ships and Chinese MIGS blowing our transport planes out of the sky. In my opinion, two carrier battle groups in the vicinity of the Spratlys would be enough to make China think twice.

 

 

so you are saying that with america fighting with us, our outdated battleship or boats will be unsinkable and our planes indestructible?

[*kalel*]

for a third world country like us, armed forces is a least priority

[camiar]

Haha! Loser mentality you say? I'm just being realistic unlike you who lives in his dreamworld saying we should put up a quiet, dignified resistance. So tell me, how can we match word with deed when you say that we should put up a quiet, dignified resistance while the Chinese are bombing the Spratlys and the US somehow reneges on its mutual defense treaty with us?

 

So you're talking tough knowing that there is a Mutual Defense Treaty with the US and our ASEAN neighbors to back us up. I was talking about a scenario wherein we would battle the Chinese by ourselves. I wonder if you would still be talking tough if we were to go toe to toe with the Chinese by ourselves and you were a soldier assigned to the Spratlys and Chinese MIGS are doing flybys threatening to bomb you to kingdom come.

 

Where in any of my post did I talk tough? I have always talked about being level headed about our weaknesses.

 

On the contrary, it was you who is bawling about how weak you are and how useless it is for people like you to resist the Chinese. It is also you who is now so overconfident in saying that IF the USA is your ally you would fight, and "just a couple of carrier groups" would keep the Chinese away... as if the US can now even afford to put even one battlegroup to back us up on our territorial dispute.

 

Your inconsistency stinks. You're just being realistic? Realistic na pala and tawag ngayon sa mga walang bayag.

 

As in.. "mga pards, kayo na lang ang humarap sa mga instik... realistic kasi ako eh..." HAHAHAHAHA! pathetic...

 

Wasn't it you who posted this? "There are lots of ways we can deter China from using its military advantage to take over the Kalayaan Island. One way is to grovel submissively to the Chinese."

 

Hahaha! That sarcastic statement was posted specifically for you to chew on. Have you been practicing your grovelling lately?

Edited July 17, 2011 by camiar

[camiar]

Did I even imply that our outdated battleships or boats will be unsinkable and our planes indestructible? Since the US would be on our side, we won't have to worry about Chinese subs torpedoing our transport ships because US Los Angeles/Virginia class submarines (hunter-killers) would be on the prowl tracking down Chinese subs that dare to torpedo our transport/battle ships.

This is hilarious! You are so ignorant on US policy on military engagements.

You really believe the US will fight our wars for us? Sure they will give us military hardware and intelligence support, but to think that they will act like our personal body guards and fight in our place? You're so naive.

 

Don't believe everything you read in Tom Clancy's novels.

Edited July 17, 2011 by camiar

[jopoc]

Did I even imply that our outdated battleships or boats will be unsinkable and our planes indestructible?

 

 

yes you did.

 

 

Since the US would be on our side, we won't have to worry about Chinese subs torpedoing our transport ships because US Los Angeles/Virginia class submarines (hunter-killers) would be on the prowl tracking down Chinese subs that dare to torpedo our transport/battle ships.

 

after thought (or palusot). you should have mentioned this a post ago.

 

but i still think this thing you are saying lacks factual basis.

 

but let me ask you, did the US commit any kind of battleship or submarine or figther plane in case they fight with us?

 

you must be have a basis for saying that the US los angeles/virginia will be used in fighting the chinese. can you show us your basis?

 

or is this purely speculative like the US will be embarassed if they dont honor the treaty (something to the effect)?