Build A Model Body!

[THUG]

I agree with olympus in terms of the powerlifers.  It is integral for them to have a maximum Muscle output in the shortest amount of time.  This type of muscle work dictates the final form that they have during their competition weight. 

 

I guess another anology would be to look at the best athletes at the top of their game.  I can easily say that the ones who do the most cardio ie. marathon runners, cyclists, long distance runners, iron man etc suffer from excessive muscle catabolism..  The best physique are the ones who do 50 meter sprints, gymnastics, divers, swimmers, etc.  These are the people who can harness a maximum muscle ouput and maintain it for a span of not more than 10 minutes... and are able to keep on doing that... If you parallelize it to working out, does this mean that shorter sets with intense but low reps is the way to go? 

 

These big fat powerlifters need to be such because of the natural tendency of a to be able to displace more mass if you have more mass as well..  For example, its easier for a big 200 pound guy to be able to bench 200 pounds than for a 140 pound guy of the same height to bench 200 pounds... ganun lang yun

 

also i completely disagree in terms of using the weighing scale as a means of measuring progress.  It depends kasi on how u gauge yer progess... for example me... I am at 205 pounds but it doesn't seem like it when i do my 12 rep full pull up and when i bench my weight... In fact i am losing inches in my waist but my weight stays the same... it does go down a bit but only if i switch over my training to weight loss.  This is when i start to factor in diet and a certain amount of muscle catabolism.. If only mayaman tayo, the best way to really measure progress is Fat loss percentage and strength to mass ratio...

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you people are comparing ELITE athletes with people who just wanna get fit.. hahaha.. definitely those are very different.. elite endurance athletes are very skinny.. that is why they are ELITE in the first place.. they have to be skinny.. the lighter you are the faster you run, the faster you cycle, and so on..

 

are people who post here wanna become an elite endurance athlete or wanna get fit and build a MODEL body? lets be precise and up to the topic.. you cannot get too skinny like a olympic marathon runner if your body is not built the same way.. no matter how you starve yourself and no matter how far you run..

 

the topic is MODEL body.. a model body has low fat..it should be sexy, with toned muscles.. not HUGE.. if you wanna look intimidating like a niteclub bouncer then continue with high weights low reps ..and do short cardio.. but then this topic is not about developing a body like that of a fat and huge niteclub bouncer.. its developing a model body.. like marc nelson, or brad pitt etc..

 

its basically the same things why i hate going to the gym is i see guys who keep on lifting heavy weights but are still packing lots of fat.. most of these dont even do proper warmup and cooldown on the treadmill..

 

i even see one on the gym who has large muscles did treadmill, then went out of the treadmill to answer a phone call not realizing he left the treadmill on and will speed up anytime soon..then he climb up the treadmill, bigla na lang kame may narinig na malakas na lagabog hahaha.. sadsad sa floor si loko..anlaki laking tanga... gusto ko sana tumawa e pinigilan ko lang..hahahaha.. :thumbsupsmiley:

[THUG]

Apparently, you haven't seen the lighter weightlifters or powerlifters who have to maintain a weight for them to compete in a certain class...

 

Also, have you ever cnsidered that ardio is not relevant for a power lifter? fat WWE wrestlers? Sure big show is definitely fat.. I doubt if you canj say that about Randy Orton, Chris Masters, Batista or even Rob Conway.

 

When going on a fatloss plan, the key in resistance training is you have to do the same thing you did when building muscle. You want to maximize fat loss and minimize muscle loss. So the only difference between a fatloss program and a muscle building program is that the fatloss program has more energy system work and you have a stricter diet...

 

Please get your facts straight before distorting them

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yes get facts straight..the topic is about MODEL body..not a wrestler body..

 

a model body is trim and toned like that of jericho rosales, richard gomez, piolo pascual, etc..

[Equus]

ahh... ohnga pala... model body.

 

Good point regarding people who just want to get fit... however In my experience with people, you never really get to the point of god given proportions unless pinagkakakitaan mo yung itsura mo... like models do... hehehehehe...

 

A friend of mine wanted to buy all sorts of supplements from me.. up to the point of steroids etc... i tasked, pagkatapos mo gumastos, mapagkikitaan mo ba yung itsura mo? he said no... so whats the point? them models and good looking people make money off the way they look..

 

In any case, i disagree with the bigger people who will never get marathon runner thin. Sure genetics play a role but to a certain extent only. Marathon runners get to be that way because of WHAT THEY DO... they are not that way KAYA SILA NAGING MARATHON RUNNERS. Having a stick thin body is not the cause for a person doing marathon cardio stuff, it is the effect when a person DECIDES to do that marathon running stuff... Yes they have to be thin for me speed etc, but being that way IS A RESULT OF THE ACTIVITIES THAT THEY DO.. IT IS NOT THE CAUSE FOR THEM TO DO THEIR ACTIVITIES.

 

I do however agree with you regarding the fat folk who do heavy reps and sets... but then again, some people do have bigorexia... That is their option.

 

I guess what Olympus is trying to say is that if you are not there yet and starting from scratch, there was little physiological basis that what you had stated will hold true... The program that you cited are for people who are already there... they are for people who are just maintaining how they look. Tayong mga munting nilalang however still have a FAR way to go... There is a difference in a maintenance program from a developing one. Thats why when you see someone with a body that you like, don't ask him what his program is now... that will never work for you if yer starting from scratch... Ask him about all the s@%t that he had to go through thats why ngayon pa easy easy nalang siya...

 

BTW whether Elite or not, they are still human therefore elite athletes still fall inside the same kinesiological and physiological principles that rule all of us... Variances in genetics do occur but the principles are the SAME..

[THUG]

ahh... ohnga pala... model body. 

 

Good point regarding people who just want to get fit... however In my experience with people, you never really get to the point of god given proportions unless pinagkakakitaan mo yung itsura mo... like models do... hehehehehe...

 

A friend of mine wanted to buy all sorts of supplements from me.. up to the point of steroids etc... i tasked, pagkatapos mo gumastos, mapagkikitaan mo ba yung itsura mo?  he said no... so whats the point?  them models and good looking people make money off the way they look..

 

In any case, i disagree with the bigger people who will never get marathon runner thin.  Sure genetics play a role but to a certain extent only.  Marathon runners get to be that way because of WHAT THEY DO... they are not that way KAYA SILA NAGING MARATHON RUNNERS.  Having a stick thin body is not the cause for a person doing marathon cardio stuff, it is the effect when a person DECIDES to do that marathon running stuff...  Yes they have to be thin for me speed etc, but being that way IS A RESULT OF THE ACTIVITIES THAT THEY DO.. IT IS NOT THE CAUSE FOR THEM TO DO THEIR ACTIVITIES.

 

I do however agree with you regarding the fat folk who do heavy reps and sets... but then again, some people do have bigorexia... That is their option. 

 

I guess what Olympus is trying to say is that if you are not there yet and starting from scratch, there was little physiological basis that what you had stated will hold true... The program that you cited are for people who are already there... they are for people who are just maintaining how they look.  Tayong mga munting nilalang however still have a FAR way to go... There is a difference in a maintenance program from a developing one.  Thats why when you see someone with a body that you like, don't ask him what his program is now... that will never work for you if yer starting from scratch... Ask him about all the s@%t that he had to go through thats why ngayon pa easy easy nalang siya...

 

BTW whether Elite or not, they are still human therefore elite athletes still fall inside the same kinesiological and physiological principles that rule all of us... Variances in genetics do occur but the principles are the SAME..

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thats the point.. a lot of people go to the gym lift weights to build muscles for the goal of attracting the opposite sex.. or intimidate the same sex.. they want to look huge and gain respect.. they have very low self esteem and want to be accepted.. somehow there are some bodybuilders who suffer some psychological problems..which is why they are not contented with just having average toned muscles..they want to be different, they want to be huge..

 

 

the idea about getting fit should be for health reasons.. when you are healthy then you are less susceptible to high blood, heart disease, cancer, etc.. so you save a lot of money..you live longer so you can enjoy life more and have fun with your kids and family..

 

but some people overlook this.. and have a different goal why they lift weights

 

 

PS: I'm also a marathon runner. But im not thin. Just ideal weight. Im buff.

Edited April 20, 2006 by THUG

[Olympus]

Many guys fail to achieve their goals since they follow the routine of drug induced bodybuilders..

 

To achieve the lean and toned look, sticking to the basic, compound lifts using free weights is your best bet.

 

For cardio, short, intense sessions help rev up your metabolism and burn fat faster than long sessions.

 

Training is really simple, people just complicate it and are often lazy

[THUG]

Many guys fail to achieve their goals since they follow the routine of drug induced bodybuilders..

 

To achieve the lean and toned look, sticking to the basic, compound lifts using  free weights is your best bet.

 

For cardio, short, intense sessions help rev up your metabolism and burn fat faster than long sessions.

 

Training is really simple, people just complicate it and are often lazy

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i disagree short cardio sessions burn fat faster.. it does not burn that much amount of fat as longer, less intense cardio sessions ..

 

the weight loss from short intense cardio comes from burning glycogen which is stored carbohydrates on the muscles..and some fat.. the more intense you do your cardio the more glycogen you burn... yes you lose weight, but that is not pure fat..

 

 

to really burn fat.. and avoid glycogen depletion, you have to do your cardio long and slow.. doing long and slow cardio teaches your body to use FAT as a source of energy..

 

we have to consider that FAT is not a good source of energy..its carbohydrates is what our body uses when we exercise.. so to tap on to those fat.. do it LOOOOONG AND SLOOOOOW....

 

 

also doing intense cardio session is bad on your joints.. you should not attempt to run fast unless you have build your endurance..

 

 

also long cardio builds your endurance and stamina.. the more endurance you have, the longer you lift weights.. the more weights you could lift...

 

and as long as you dont lose more than 2 lbs of weight per week, you are not losing muscle..its also imposible to lose muscle if you lift weights.. so again there is something wrong with that posting..

Edited April 20, 2006 by THUG

[Olympus]

Here we go again...

 

Before making a comment, I suggest you go through a Crossfit WOD or a Tabata session.

 

You burn calories whe you workout, fatloss is achieved through a caloric deficit.

 

I'll just use this simple analogy, why are sprinters more build than long distance runners?

 

i disagree short cardio sessions burn fat faster.. it does not burn that much amount of fat as longer, less intense cardio sessions ..

 

the weight loss from short intense cardio comes from burning glycogen which is stored carbohydrates on the muscles..and some fat.. the more intense you do your cardio the more glycogen you burn... yes you lose weight, but that is not pure fat..

to really burn fat.. and avoid glycogen depletion, you have to do your cardio long and slow.. doing long and slow cardio teaches your body to use FAT as a source of energy..

 

we have to consider that  FAT is not a good source of energy..its carbohydrates is what our body uses when we exercise.. so to tap on to those fat.. do it LOOOOONG AND SLOOOOOW....

also doing intense cardio session is bad on your joints.. you should not attempt to run fast unless you have build your endurance..

also long cardio builds your endurance and stamina.. the more endurance you have, the longer you lift weights.. the more weights you could lift...

 

and as long as you dont lose more than 2 lbs of weight per week, you are not losing muscle..its also imposible to lose muscle if you lift weights.. so again there is something wrong with that posting..

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[Equus]

again i must agree with Olympus here. Long drawn out cardio IS GOOD but it is not the be-all end-all... Short intense cardio work outs, when done correctly(certain amount of experience needed here as well..) reduces fat faster and more efficiently due to a afterburn effect that you submit your body too... I guess a combination of both should do. One of the guys who work oout in the gym does the short intense cardio during work out but once a week he would do a long 10 kilometer run. His body looks really toned and defined as well..

 

I am contemplating on the psyche of people who lift weights due to self esteem deficit... puwede yun... but isn't that the basis of all work outs? I mean if we were happy with ourselves and how we look per say, we wouldn't be working out anymore diba? Doing the gym thing for health reasons is sound but that statement also hints that since yer not happy or satisfied with yer health regime, then you would do work out.. isn't that another form of insecurity and low self esteem?

 

In any case, i am one of those guys who lift weights because at any point in the day im happy with the fact that I'm basically stronger and more fit than the regular joe..

 

Referring back to what Olympus said, to lose fat, you have to be consuming more calories than what yer taking in.. Therefore a fibrous diet with a lot of bulk and less calories is the best way to go. Less sugars, and carbs. Im really still in the dark as to what is the ideal diet.

 

In reference to your glycogen depletion, glycogen is the fat stored in the liver... Depletion of that fat is good and when that is done and over, your body will start sourcing into yer other fat stores such as the one that is found under the skin, under the chin, etc... hehehehe

 

Again, the simplest way to look at it is calories consumed should be lower than the calories needed by the body to do work.. if that situation happens, vavavoom.. you lose weight..

 

keeping your body temperature high will keep yer metabolism up thus make you lose yer fat stores a lot faster..

[THUG]

Here we go again...

 

Before making a comment, I suggest you go through a Crossfit WOD or a Tabata session.

 

You burn calories whe you workout, fatloss is achieved through a caloric deficit.

 

I'll just use this simple analogy, why are sprinters more build than long distance runners?

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see.. you are again comparing elite athletes.. you see natural long distance runners are inborn thin and light.. they don't get thin by running long.. they are already thin from the very start..

 

elite sprinters on the other hand also start thin.. but then they have to lift weights for power. to build muscles for explosive action.. they need upper body power to propel themselves too..

 

elite sprinters dont build muscles just by sprinting..thats the the stupidest thing i heard..

 

 

i guess its this wrong notion why I see a lot of guys a the gym beside me on the treadmill running fast on the treadmill till they loss breath and then suddenly STOP.. .wow.. that is bad for your heart..

 

makes me wonder where they pick up those silly ideas..

 

also why is there a thread here about weightlifting injuries? same wrong belief.. lifting heavy and doing fast cardio.. very wrong.. fitness end product should be for good health not to impress..

[Olympus]

Who said I was comparing elite athlets top the average Joe? We use Tabata for any fitness level.

 

Runners, regardless if sprinter or marathon runner, both lift weights, yet they use different energy system work. One uses aerobic, and the other anaerobic.

 

Apparently, you still have no clue about what you're talking about...

 

Every program I make starts with two purposes, structural and functional.

 

see.. you are again comparing elite athletes..  you see natural long distance runners are inborn thin and light..  they don't get thin by running long.. they are already thin from the very start.. 

 

elite sprinters on the other hand also start thin..  but then they have to lift weights for power. to build muscles for explosive action.. they need upper body power to propel themselves too..

 

elite sprinters dont build muscles just by sprinting..thats the the stupidest thing i heard.. 

i guess its this wrong notion why I see a lot of guys a the gym beside me on the treadmill running fast on the treadmill till they loss breath and then suddenly STOP.. .wow.. that is bad for your heart.. 

 

makes me wonder where they pick up those silly ideas..

 

also why is there a thread here about weightlifting injuries? same wrong belief.. lifting heavy and doing fast cardio.. very wrong..  fitness end product should be for good health not to impress..

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[THUG]

Who said I was comparing elite athlets top the average Joe? We use Tabata for any fitness level.

 

Runners, regardless if sprinter or marathon runner, both lift weights, yet they use different energy system work. One uses aerobic, and the other anaerobic.

 

Apparently, you still have no clue about what you're talking about...

 

Every program I make starts with two purposes, structural and functional.

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yes..and anaerobic training burns and depletes more glycogen than tapping on using body fat as fuel..

 

fast running does have after burn.. but its mostly glycogen and some fat that gets burned..

 

to train a body to burn fat it should be purely low aerobic.. around 60 to 70% of Maximum Heart Rate

 

or (220- age) x 0.6..

 

it takes less effort..no hard breathing..low incidence of injury.. just pure fat burning..as long as you do it 4x a week in 40 minutes non stop.. but it should be gradual increase..

 

as i said earlier.. fat is not a good source of energy.. our body uses carbohydrates to fuel us.. to tap fat you have to exercise longer.. but to preserve precious carbohydrates you have to do it slower..

[Olympus]

I'm assuming you are focusing more on the aerobic energy system of the body and exclusing the anaerobic system...

 

You need to tap both the aerobic and anaerobic energy system in order to burn fat. Whether aerobic or anaerobic, among the 3 macros, carbs are always burnt first, and glycogen will always be depleted in any streonous activity.

 

The objectiv of an energy system workout is to be able to revv up your metabolism, even after working out aka EPOC or simply energy post working oxidation consumed. (sp?)

 

This is what makes the Tabata protocol and HIIT superior to the purely aerobic system. Doing intervals alternating between working hard and pacing yourself has been proven to help burn fat more than just doing energy system work slow and long.

 

yes..and anaerobic training burns and depletes more glycogen than tapping on using body fat as fuel..

 

fast running does have after burn.. but its mostly glycogen and some fat that gets burned..

 

to train a body to burn fat it should be purely low aerobic.. around 60 to 70% of Maximum Heart Rate

 

or  (220- age) x 0.6.. 

 

it takes less effort..no hard breathing..low incidence of injury.. just pure fat burning..as long as you do it 4x a week in 40 minutes non stop.. but it should be gradual increase..

 

as i said earlier.. fat is not a good source of energy.. our body uses carbohydrates to fuel us.. to tap fat you have to exercise longer.. but to preserve precious carbohydrates you have to do it slower..

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[Equus]

okay okay okay... My take... Ive read the tabata protocol and it seems very sound.. Its basic principle is a persons capacity to load up on both the anaerobic stress level and the aerobic stress level. I beg to disagree with you Thug, it DOES NOT matter whether yer burning up Carbs, Glycogen, etc.. The point thats being stressed here is,

 

1.) to lose weight, you have to be using more calories than what you are consuming..

 

2.) calories comes in many different forms regardless whether carb, protein, sugars, fats, etc.

 

3.) basic physiology is for any movement whether voluntary or involuntary, energy needs to be used, tis is in its basic form, ATP. ATP is produced via the Krebs cycle by utilizing glucose and turning it into ATP.. Glucose can be accessed via the different energy pathways, glycolysis, gluconeogenesis, etc...

 

4.) At the basic of it all, If you perform a voluntary, routinary, muscular function, you need ATP produced through glucose, coursed through carbs or proteins, etc...

 

5.) In this respect, i will have to agree with olympus in regards to the Tabata Method. Given the basic physiological principles that rule us all, I am convinced that the work out that can reach the peak of a body's aerobic and anaerobic capacity regardless the amount of time, but can be maintained, is the best work out possible... As long as you don't k*ll yerself or injure yerself in the process...

 

Thug, I must admit that your principles are very sound but they are classical in a sense... Its just like that thing with Arnold Schwarzenegger.. he FIRMLY believed in spot training and spot reduction.. If you want to lose yer gut, do abs... you want to lose yer fat around yer triceps, do tricep work outs... Now, we ALL know this to be false... but dude, will ANY OF US TELL ARNOLD THAT HE WAS WRONG? I'm pretty sure wala sa atin may karapatan to go up to him and tell him na mali siya... heheheheh diba.. You are right in a sense Thug but nowadays, there are more efficient ways of doing yer workout to get the best results at the most efficient amount of time....

[guile1912]

You're joking right?  Muscle mags are the worst sources of information out there. They contain routines designed for the roid community and any natural guy would soon burn out on those routines..

 

Abs are made in the kitchen, not in the gym. You can do all the exercises you want but if your diet is trash, you'll never achieve the six pack

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when reading any source of info, dapat maging selective ka.

 

yes you are right sir, meron mga routines for the roids, pero meron din mga info para sa natural.

even beginners and pros alike can get tips on exercises featured here.

and i dont think (in my own opinion) what they are doing is wrong because of the results they are showing and what i am getting doing these workouts.

 

meron mga things na maituturo dito n hindi alam ng most.

 

you wont burnout on these exercises. each body is unique. you have to tailor your own workout for you.

 

what work with guy may not work with the next guy.

 

we all have abs naman, pero its covered with fat (with a good reason- for health and safety), you cant show your cut abs without working it out. abs is like any muscle. to have a good muscle you must supply it with good food. if you dont combine your diet with exercise, its trash d b?

 

 

 

im just here to help others by telling them about my own opinion and giving them options

 

[THUG]

okay okay okay... My take... Ive read the tabata protocol and it seems very sound.. Its basic principle is a persons capacity to load up on both the anaerobic stress level and the aerobic stress level.  I beg to disagree with you Thug, it DOES NOT matter whether yer burning up Carbs, Glycogen, etc..  The point thats being stressed here is,

 

1.)  to lose weight, you have to be using more calories than what you are consuming..

 

2.)  calories comes in many different forms regardless whether carb, protein, sugars, fats, etc.

 

3.) basic physiology is for any movement whether voluntary or involuntary, energy needs to be used, tis is in its basic form, ATP. ATP is produced via the Krebs cycle by utilizing glucose and turning it into ATP.. Glucose can be accessed via the different energy pathways, glycolysis, gluconeogenesis, etc...

 

4.) At the basic of it all, If you perform a voluntary, routinary, muscular function, you need ATP produced through glucose, coursed through carbs or proteins, etc...

 

5.) In this respect, i will have to agree with olympus in regards to the Tabata Method.  Given the basic physiological principles that rule us all, I am convinced that the work out that can reach the peak of a body's aerobic and anaerobic capacity regardless the amount of time, but can be maintained, is the best work out possible... As long as you don't k*ll yerself or injure yerself in the process...

 

Thug, I must admit that your principles are very sound but they are classical in a sense... Its just like that thing with Arnold Schwarzenegger.. he FIRMLY believed in spot training and spot reduction.. If you want to lose yer gut, do abs... you want to lose yer fat around yer triceps, do tricep work outs... Now, we ALL know this to be false... but dude, will ANY OF US TELL ARNOLD THAT HE WAS WRONG?  I'm pretty sure wala sa atin may karapatan to go up to him and tell him na mali siya... heheheheh diba.. You are right in a sense Thug but nowadays, there are more efficient ways of doing yer workout to get the best results at the most efficient amount of time....

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tabata tabata method.. just keep on working out.. and you lose weight and get toned.. look at powerlifters, these groups of athletes are mostly fat.. very bad shape if you tell me..

 

problem with people who go to the gym is they keep themself so engulfed with technicalities and theories.. basta buhat lang buhat, at takbo ng takbo! dont try to believe what these and that person say.. e baka gumagastos ng 30k pesos a month sa nutrition yan kaya mas maganda katawan sa yo..

 

 

i have been with people in the gym who do nothing but try to impress others by lifting heavy weights, then take long rest and chit chat..up to now they still have that same ugly fat body.. :thumbsdownsmiley:

 

while me i have made improvements and developed 4 pack abs with only 2 months of cardio training and lifting low weights with 15-20 reps.. and I dont even take those creatine, whey protein etc..

 

all i eat is natural foods, fruits, veggies, fish.. thats all..

 

lift weights for good health not to IMPRESS..