Supplements - to Take or Not to Take?

[Jacques]

Muscle milk s good but not as soluble as syntha 6, another good choice is nitrocore 24.

 

I'd swap beta alanine for GH max

 

I Agree!!! Nitrocore 24 by ON is damn good! Cheaper and almost as good as Syntha 6. I've recently just purchased 4 5 pounders for my contest prep along with natural whey of ON. And yes it's damn cheaper than Nitrotech / Syntha 6. Tastes good and satisfying too.

[Jacques]

Oh well. either way, I saw people waste money, some a ton on supplements and only produce expensive pee. Lots of overpriced PT,making lifting complicated instead of simple and effective. I don't believe in it. Unless mag karga ka, pero I consider this pointless (pasintabi nalang sa mga kumakarga) unless you really plan to compete.

 

I agree. However, I'd say if you really have to purchase supplements, I'd go for whey and maybe creatine in the off season. Other supplements are luxaries.

 

For the sake of discussion, "juicing" has been a very taboo issue. It's like back in the days where cosmetic surgery draws too much controversies. Today Cosmetic Clinics have been mainstream long enough for the public to welcome this approach to vanity. In gyms today, more than ever before, you see a lot of people experementing with roids for the simple reason: vanity. The only thing that bothers me here is that some of this people are too damn lazy too even research and get the proper info they need and only rely on uneducated trainers on how to juice properly and responsibly. This is where trouble begins.

 

Just my 2 cents.

[delavega]

I agree. However, I'd say if you really have to purchase supplements, I'd go for whey and maybe creatine in the off season. Other supplements are luxaries.

 

For the sake of discussion, "juicing" has been a very taboo issue. It's like back in the days where cosmetic surgery draws too much controversies. Today Cosmetic Clinics have been mainstream long enough for the public to welcome this approach to vanity. In gyms today, more than ever before, you see a lot of people experementing with roids for the simple reason: vanity. The only thing that bothers me here is that some of this people are too damn lazy too even research and get the proper info they need and only rely on uneducated trainers on how to juice properly and responsibly. This is where trouble begins.

 

Just my 2 cents.

 

hehe. I'd rather spend that money on Egg whites and chicken/turkey breast. Have you ever seen the documentary "bigger faster stronger?" It really is a must see. @ my gym, you will always see syringes on the thrash can. Temporary muscles as we naturals call it. Quite frankly, I do not see anything with juicing, if you are a professional competitor. But for vanity's sake? It's too much. (again, pasinatabi sa mga nagkakarga). anything abused leads to trouble imo. There is something the muscle magazines aren't telling a lot of people. Magic pills? there is no such thing.

 

Can anyone here tell me their experience with the breathing 20 squats program?

[Olympus]

I agree. However, I'd say if you really have to purchase supplements, I'd go for whey and maybe creatine in the off season. Other supplements are luxaries.

 

I'd actually add beta alanine into the mix. its the most underated supplement nowadays.

 

hehe. I'd rather spend that money on Egg whites and chicken/turkey breast. Have you ever seen the documentary "bigger faster stronger?" It really is a must see. @ my gym, you will always see syringes on the thrash can. Temporary muscles as we naturals call it. Quite frankly, I do not see anything with juicing, if you are a professional competitor. But for vanity's sake? It's too much. (again, pasinatabi sa mga nagkakarga). anything abused leads to trouble imo. There is something the muscle magazines aren't telling a lot of people. Magic pills? there is no such thing. smile.gif

 

a lot of people are just really lazy and want the easy way.

 

Can anyone here tell me their experience with the breathing 20 squats program?

 

short anecdote... don't do this if you are driving a stick. Nearly had 3 accidents in one day after the squat session. It also tests your determination and drive but produces good results

[machme]

my supps:

multivitamins

century tuna

milk

milo

oatmeal

peanut butter

 

For me are:

Meat, chicken w/o the skin

fruits, sometime shakes with milk

milk

fiber foods and carbs (potato or kamote) muscle building..

energy drink lang k na

[sikosci]

you guys tried metabolic whey?

[Olympus]

you guys tried metabolic whey?

 

MRM metabolic whey?

[Jacques]

hehe. I'd rather spend that money on Egg whites and chicken/turkey breast. Have you ever seen the documentary "bigger faster stronger?" It really is a must see. @ my gym, you will always see syringes on the thrash can. Temporary muscles as we naturals call it. Quite frankly, I do not see anything with juicing, if you are a professional competitor. But for vanity's sake? It's too much. (again, pasinatabi sa mga nagkakarga). anything abused leads to trouble imo. There is something the muscle magazines aren't telling a lot of people. Magic pills? there is no such thing.

 

Can anyone here tell me their experience with the breathing 20 squats program?

Dude, I'm not implying that you use whey and creatine to "replace" food protein sources. I'm saying is that whey they have a place in "complementing/supplementing" your diet if you have the money to burn. Now if you have a tight budget, why even bother?

 

And yes I've seen that documentary. Performance/physique enhancing drugs is an open secret on which draws a lot of controversies and shares a lot of different opinions. At the end of the day, it's a choice one has to make.

 

Going back to the topic, I highly reccomend anyone who's into weightlifting to use whey. Why? If you do the math correctly, a 5 lb tub of whey (70-80servings) would roughly cost you between P2000-P2500 (That is if you know where to get them at these prices). A serving (20-24grams of protein) would cost between 30-40 pesos. If I equate that to chicken eggs/egg whites which cost between 4-6 pesos per piece and will roughly take at least 6-8pcs for me to get the same protein amount, I'd practically go for whey. Needless to say, it's damn more convinient to ingest suring those times I need my protein but dont have the apettite to chow down another meal. My point here is that, whey has its place on a strategic diet plan. For some it's a luxary but to me, it very well supports my protein requirements. Lastly, let me reiterate that I never adviced nor practice using whey in replacing my breakfast, lunch and supper.

Edited February 3, 2009 by Jacques

[delavega]

Dude, I'm not implying that you use whey and creatine to "replace" food protein sources. I'm saying is that whey they have a place in "complementing/supplementing" your diet if you have the money to burn. Now if you have a tight budget, why even bother?

 

And yes I've seen that documentary. Performance/physique enhancing drugs is an open secret on which draws a lot of controversies and shares a lot of different opinions. At the end of the day, it's a choice one has to make.

 

Going back to the topic, I highly reccomend anyone who's into weightlisting to really use whey. Why? If you do the math correctly, a 5 lb tub of whey (70-80servings) would roughly cost you between P2000-P2500 (That is if you know where to get them at these prices). A serving (20-24grams of protein) would cost between 30-40 pesos. If I equate that to chicken eggs/egg whites which cost between 4-6 pesos per piece and will roughly take at least 6-8pcs for me to get the same protein amount, I'd practically go for whey. Needless to say, it's damn more convinient to ingest suring those times I need my protein but dont have the apettite to chow down another meal. My point here is that, whey has its place on a strategic diet plan. For some it's a luxary but to me, it very well supports my protein requirements. Lastly, let me reiterate that I never adviced nor practice using whey in replacing my breakfast, lunch and supper.

 

ey bro. i didn't take it the way you thought i took it. chill. no one's judging anyone here. *lol* :thumbsupsmiley: You may have assumed wrong, but then again that's your pov. I said that in a jokingly manner. It was just a simple comment. "to supplement or not to supplement" is a personal choice. i agree. we all have our pov's about training and nutrition. I don't mean to step on the toes of people who take it and rely on it. (again, this goes out to the general public)

 

as for whey and any fad supplement, I just don't believe in taking them. With regards to money to burn, I think i would be able to save more if I were to replace partial of my meals with whey protein but I wouldn't want to. I always try to avoid oxidised cholesterol.

 

People who want to take their chances on supplementing to put Some Meat on their Bones!, Go ahead ad get some of those lab created stuff.. If all fails, then i'll see you back at the basics area.

[Jacques]

ey bro. i didn't take it the way you thought i took it. chill. no one's judging anyone here. *lol* :thumbsupsmiley: You may have assumed wrong, but then again that's your pov. I said that in a jokingly manner. It was just a simple comment. "to supplement or not to supplement" is a personal choice. i agree. we all have our pov's about training and nutrition. I don't mean to step on the toes of people who take it and rely on it. (again, this goes out to the general public)

 

as for whey and any fad supplement, I just don't believe in taking them. With regards to money to burn, I think i would be able to save more if I were to replace partial of my meals with whey protein but I wouldn't want to. I always try to avoid oxidised cholesterol.

 

People who want to take their chances on supplementing to put Some Meat on their Bones!, Go ahead ad get some of those lab created stuff.. If all fails, then i'll see you back at the basics area.

Whey protein? Oxidised cholesterol? Geesh where did you come up with such stuff? Do you know how whey is manufactured? :upside:

[delavega]

Whey protein? Oxidised cholesterol? Geesh where did you come up with such stuff? Do you know how whey is manufactured? :upside:

 

 

I'm an RN, with MAN units. Learned about it in nursing school. Every powderized food has that fyi.

[Jacques]

I'm an RN, with MAN units. Learned about it in nursing school. Every powderized food has that fyi.

Apparently you've been generalizing so much my friend. Well my family is into the dairy business and we have been supplying whey protein isolates (by product of cheese production) and concentrates to some of the biggest milk brands locally and abroad. these proteins are virtually cholesterol and lactose free.

[delavega]

Apparently you've been generalizing so much my friend. Well my family is into the dairy business and we have been supplying whey protein isolates (by product of cheese production) and concentrates to some of the biggest milk brands locally and abroad. these proteins are virtually cholesterol and lactose free.

 

 

first, http://www.nutritiondiscounters.com/v/vspfiles/photos/67110-1.jpg

 

second, Whey Protein powders cholesterol free? I beg to differ, from a medical pov. PURE Whey protein isolates, maybe! a low amount, less than 15mg per scoop. Higher than that would mean it's main component is whey concentrates. These concentrates are to oxidized to a large degree. The number goes up when they are in storage. Again, I am speaking of the common Whey protein powders. Not the RAW material used. The one sold as a supplement? like ON, mrm etc.. (SUPPLEMENTS to take or not to take?)

 

Now, If you produce isolates of the cleanest form, then good for you. All you need is for it to be analyzed by a lab. Sell and help people discover the safe way to whey. I guess that makes you the resident house speaker for whey.

 

Whey Powders:

 

Optimum 100% Whey Protein

Amount Per Serving

Calories 130

Calories From Fat 15

% Daily Value*

Total Fat 1.5g 2%

Saturated Fat 1g 5%

Trans Fat 0g

Cholesterol 30mg 10%

Sodium 60mg 3%

Total Carbohydrate 4g 1%

Sugars 1g

Protein 24g

 

Ingredients:

Protein Blend(Whey Protein Isolates, Whey Protein Concentrate, Whey Peptides), Cocoa(Processed With Alkali), Coffee, Natural And Artificial Flavor, Lecithin, Acesulfame Potassium, Aminogen®, Sucralose, Lactase

 

MRM Metabolic Whey

Amount Per Serving

Calories 120.5

Calories From Fat 22.5

% Daily Value*

Total Fat 2.5g 4%

Saturated Fat 0.75g 3.5%

Cholesterol 25mg 6%

Sodium 50mg 2%

Potassium 125mg 3.5%

Total Carbohydrates 3g <1%

Fiber 0.5g 2%

Sugars 2g**

Protein 22 44%

 

 

META-Pro™ (Ultrafiltered, Low Temperature Processed Instantized Whey Protein Concentrate, Cross Flow Microfiltered Whey Protein Isolate, & NitroZyme™ - A Proteolytic Enzyme Preparation Containing Bioactive Peptidases Derived From A Plant Source), Cocoa, Natural & Artificial Flavors, Lecithin, Medium Chain Triglycerides (MCTs), Xanthan Gum, & Sucralose.

 

cholesterol and lactose free (not popular, and only a number of products, not commonly used and hard to get in the pi. why? because of it's price tag)

Protein Factory CFM Whey Isolate

Amount Per Serving % Daily Value*

Calories 90

Calories From Fat 0

Total Fat 0g 0%

Saturated Fat 0g 0%

Trans Fat 0g %

Cholesterol 0mg 0%

Sodium 60mg 3%

Total Carbohydrate 1g 0%

Dietary Fiber 0g 0%

Sugars 1g

Protein 21g

 

 

But I guess jacques produces something like this locally, then that's good news to everyone who would use whey.

[RustyXIII]

As long as we're on the subject, what are the whey powder brands that taste good? Information on protein contents and nutritional values, as well as price, are readily available but views on taste are hard to come by. I know taste is subjective, but I have no choice but to trust recommendations because it would be an expensive learning experience if I went out and tried them all.

[Olympus]

As long as we're on the subject, what are the whey powder brands that taste good? Information on protein contents and nutritional values, as well as price, are readily available but views on taste are hard to come by. I know taste is subjective, but I have no choice but to trust recommendations because it would be an expensive learning experience if I went out and tried them all.

 

I'd say optimum is always a reliable source.

 

Some say MRM tastes good but that I have no idea of.

[Jacques]

first, http://www.nutritiondiscounters.com/v/vspfiles/photos/67110-1.jpg

 

second, Whey Protein powders cholesterol free? I beg to differ, from a medical pov. PURE Whey protein isolates, maybe! a low amount, less than 15mg per scoop. Higher than that would mean it's main component is whey concentrates. These concentrates are to oxidized to a large degree. The number goes up when they are in storage. Again, I am speaking of the common Whey protein powders. Not the RAW material used. The one sold as a supplement? like ON, mrm etc.. (SUPPLEMENTS to take or not to take?)

 

Now, If you produce isolates of the cleanest form, then good for you. All you need is for it to be analyzed by a lab. Sell and help people discover the safe way to whey. I guess that makes you the resident house speaker for whey.

 

Whey Powders:

 

Optimum 100% Whey Protein

Amount Per Serving

Calories 130

Calories From Fat 15

% Daily Value*

Total Fat 1.5g 2%

Saturated Fat 1g 5%

Trans Fat 0g

Cholesterol 30mg 10%

Sodium 60mg 3%

Total Carbohydrate 4g 1%

Sugars 1g

Protein 24g

 

Ingredients:

Protein Blend(Whey Protein Isolates, Whey Protein Concentrate, Whey Peptides), Cocoa(Processed With Alkali), Coffee, Natural And Artificial Flavor, Lecithin, Acesulfame Potassium, Aminogen®, Sucralose, Lactase

 

MRM Metabolic Whey

Amount Per Serving

Calories 120.5

Calories From Fat 22.5

% Daily Value*

Total Fat 2.5g 4%

Saturated Fat 0.75g 3.5%

Cholesterol 25mg 6%

Sodium 50mg 2%

Potassium 125mg 3.5%

Total Carbohydrates 3g <1%

Fiber 0.5g 2%

Sugars 2g**

Protein 22 44%

 

 

META-Pro™ (Ultrafiltered, Low Temperature Processed Instantized Whey Protein Concentrate, Cross Flow Microfiltered Whey Protein Isolate, & NitroZyme™ - A Proteolytic Enzyme Preparation Containing Bioactive Peptidases Derived From A Plant Source), Cocoa, Natural & Artificial Flavors, Lecithin, Medium Chain Triglycerides (MCTs), Xanthan Gum, & Sucralose.

 

cholesterol and lactose free (not popular, and only a number of products, not commonly used and hard to get in the pi. why? because of it's price tag)

Protein Factory CFM Whey Isolate

Amount Per Serving % Daily Value*

Calories 90

Calories From Fat 0

Total Fat 0g 0%

Saturated Fat 0g 0%

Trans Fat 0g %

Cholesterol 0mg 0%

Sodium 60mg 3%

Total Carbohydrate 1g 0%

Dietary Fiber 0g 0%

Sugars 1g

Protein 21g

 

 

But I guess jacques produces something like this locally, then that's good news to everyone who would use whey.

You're misinterpreting things again. You are forgetting than I am reffering to whey as in the protein isolate. The cholesterol you are seeing in the nutrition facts are by products of the other ingredients to make the whey taste better. If that's how you generalize, then you shouldn't be even touching other powdered milk products to begin with. Geesh...

[Jacques]

I'd say optimum is always a reliable source.

 

Some say MRM tastes good but that I have no idea of.

In addition, I think almost everyone would agree that you get the best bang for your buck with ON... unlike pricey stuffs like Nitrotech Imagine paying 3k plus for a 2 lb tub??? :thumbsdownsmiley:

[delavega]

You're misinterpreting things again. You are forgetting than I am reffering to whey as in the protein isolate. The cholesterol you are seeing in the nutrition facts are by products of the other ingredients to make the whey taste better. If that's how you generalize, then you shouldn't be even touching other powdered milk products to begin with. Geesh...

 

I think you are the one misinterpreting it. hehe. anything to have the last word huh? *lol* funny guy. We are talking about the whey protein powder here? Is anyone here able to get the raw material itself? I always spoke about the topic itself, Whey Protein food supplement? the one used by actual people, general public/available commercially? *lol* Who ever said I take powdered milk products? I think you better get your facts straight first, The ones that are found in books and journals, before you try to lecture me.. I am just laying the facts here. So again, http://static.pyzam.com/img/thumbs/g_340/graphics/7/MJZ1634.gif :goatee: :upside:

[Jacques]

I think you are the one misinterpreting it. hehe. anything to have the last word huh? *lol* funny guy. We are talking about the whey protein powder here? Is anyone here able to get the raw material itself? I always spoke about the topic itself, Whey Protein food supplement? the one used by actual people, general public/available commercially? *lol* Who ever said I take powdered milk products? I think you better get your facts straight first, The ones that are found in books and journals, before you try to lecture me.. I am just laying the facts here. So again, http://static.pyzam.com/img/thumbs/g_340/graphics/7/MJZ1634.gif :goatee: :upside:

But you did mention you're staying away from all "powdered" food products right? If you're trying to interpret things literally go ahead. It's kinda hard arguing with a doorknob anyways. My point here is that, if you're not sold on food supplements like whey, hey, no one's forcing you. And yes, if you take your journal sources as your bible, go ahead. Just dont be too naive that just because you read it somewhere, it's already the absolute truth.

[delavega]

But you did mention you're staying away from all "powdered" food products right? If you're trying to interpret things literally go ahead. It's kinda hard arguing with a doorknob anyways. My point here is that, if you're not sold on food supplements like whey, hey, no one's forcing you. And yes, if you take your journal sources as your bible, go ahead. Just dont be too naive that just because you read it somewhere, it's already the absolute truth.

 

it is based on science, not assumptions if that's what youre saying. *lol* so it's interpretation now? i never mentioned that i was being forced on whwy. this still is a thread for opinions right? *lol* \/\/hatever you say chief... :thumbsupsmiley:

[Palakol]

this is starting to look like a sherdog thread...

[Olympus]

In addition, I think almost everyone would agree that you get the best bang for your buck with ON... unlike pricey stuffs like Nitrotech Imagine paying 3k plus for a 2 lb tub??? thumbsdownsmiley.gif

 

the ON product line is one of the most under-rated lines.

 

this is starting to look like a sherdog thread...

 

you definitely got that right.

 

next thing you know we'll have more images posted

[SixSickSleek]

guys need help here.... please pm me naman po kung anong suppliment ang pwede ko inumin para mejo pumayat i tako hydroxycut pero mejo hindi ko trip kc nag kaka pimples ako sa likod and hindi ako maka sleep unless after 10 hours after taking hydroxycut. hindi naman ako mataba konting chubby i think, 150 lbs ako i stand 5'5. kaso mejo malaki tyan ko dahil sa kakakain higa upo. pero nag work out na ako now 3x a week. ano po bang program ang pwede ko gawin para lumiit yung tyan ko? TIA! please pm me sa sagot nyo bihira lang kc ako mag online sa MTC eh TIA!

[NihonJin]

^^ i would like to ask the similar question. but i am 157lbs and 5"7 in height. i dropped from 161lbs within 3 weeks and that's a relief i say!

 

@SixSick >> i encounter the same phenomena for Hydroxycut hehe.., i got those annoying pimps in mah back also.., i switched to Lipo6 and i dunno kung dun ko naman nakuha ang An2x ko sa likod ngaun! baka madumi lang skin ko hehe..,

 

Hydroxycut recommends the dosage not less than 6 hours before bedtime i think.., pero kung almost 10 hrs at di ka pa din makatulog, i think you should not take dosages before your dinner..,

[Jacques]

^^ i would like to ask the similar question. but i am 157lbs and 5"7 in height. i dropped from 161lbs within 3 weeks and that's a relief i say!

 

@SixSick >> i encounter the same phenomena for Hydroxycut hehe.., i got those annoying pimps in mah back also.., i switched to Lipo6 and i dunno kung dun ko naman nakuha ang An2x ko sa likod ngaun! baka madumi lang skin ko hehe..,

 

Hydroxycut recommends the dosage not less than 6 hours before bedtime i think.., pero kung almost 10 hrs at di ka pa din makatulog, i think you should not take dosages before your dinner..,

You see, Hydroxycut and Lipo-6/6x basically share the same "core" ingredients (don't be misleaded by the fancy names and endless ingredients you see in the "blends" hydroxycut hardcore. Basically, you have caffein, yohimbine, green tea extracts and guggulsterons. All of which are stimulants by nature. They stimulate adrenal glands which then release adrenaline in the bloodstream. This is why some/most users experience anxiety, cold sweats and rapid palpitations even when not performing exercise. Remember that adrenaline is basically a hormone. Any surge of hormones will cause a ph change in the bloodstream. In this case, when adrenaline floods the blood, you also increase cortisol levels (indicator of stress) and for some it also slightly affects testosterone and estrogen levels to a slight degree. To sum it all, this may be the reason why some would experience acne.

 

If you'd follow my advice, take the first serving after waking up on an empty stomach, and the next (last) dose 6-8 hours after in the mid/late afternoon. Never compromise the quality and quantity of sleep you should be getting. Because lack of sleep will also cause hormonal changes in the body that can also lead to awful acne breakouts.