South China/West Philippine Sea

[kisshmet]

the taiwanese killed was the captain right, captain sits on the bridge which is located near the fore of the boat. for the captain to be shot & killed the taiwanese boat must be facing the phil coastguard boat giving credence to the claim that the chinks made an attempt to ram our coastguard vessel who were dispatched to make an attempt to intercept the interlopers withinin our territory. the death would have been impossible if our coastguard fired at those chinks from behind while giving chase

 

considering the decrepit condition of our coastguard vessels, they killed a taiwanese alright but failed to capture them because the rest of the crew made it all the way back to taiwan. in addition our coastguard cant go that far away from their homebase because of very limited fuel supply

 

now this incident called for sanction against the phil, then so be it, lets see if production in taiwanese factories will continue to be efficient with fewer pinoys manning it

 

should we be apologetic, DEFINITELY NOT. this incident is only REGRETABLE & thats it

Edited May 27, 2013 by kisshmet

[sonnyt111]

the taiwanese killed was the captain right, captain sits on the bridge which is located near the fore of the boat. for the captain to be shot & killed the taiwanese boat must be facing the phil coastguard boat giving credence to the claim that the chinks made an attempt to ram our coastguard vessel who were dispatched to make an attempt to intercept the interlopers withinin our territory. the death would have been impossible if our coastguard fired at those chinks from behind while giving chase

 

considering the decrepit condition of our coastguard vessels, they killed a taiwanese alright but failed to capture them because the rest of the crew made it all the way back to taiwan. in addition our coastguard cant go that far away from their homebase because of very limited fuel supply

 

now this incident called for sanction against the phil, then so be it, lets see if production in taiwanese factories will continue to be efficient with fewer pinoys manning it

 

should we be apologetic, DEFINITELY NOT. this incident is only REGRETABLE & thats it

A serious sanction by the Philippine government on the Taiwanese government would include ordering OFWs working there to come home. That would make the Taiwanese think twice about threatening the Philippines. That goes for other countries as well.

 

OFWs who refuse to return to the Philippines will not be able to claim any benefits from the Philippine government should they later need government assistance.

 

I can already imagine the reaction of Ms. Dungeonbaby regarding this. So ma'am you don't really have to comment on this issue because I know exactly where you stand, given your very sarcastic reply to my earlier post.

 

Besides, this isn't going to happen. This is just like wishful thinking on my part. The BS Aquino government would never ever consider something as drastic as this to show the world that we cannot be bullied and will not be bullied.

 

We have an important resource that the world needs. Our manpower. It's not oil, it's not gold, it's not diamonds. Yet the world values our manpower more than most people think. We wouldn't have these many OFWs unless there was a great demand for their services.

 

From my point of view, we should always negotiate with this in mind. Let us never be bullied by another nation with economic blackmail. Let us show the world that we, as a nation, have pride, dignity, and a willingness to sacrifice if we have to. They need us as much as we need them. But let them not deceive themselves into believing that we need them more than they need us.

 

OFWs who refuse to cooperate with our government on issues like these should be considered unpatriotic....unwilling to sacrifice for their country. So when they need the help of their country, they're on their own. It's about time we started looking beyond our families and our own self interests. It's about time we looked at ourselves as a nation. It's time for Filipinos to put the Philippines' interests over their own.

Edited May 27, 2013 by sonnyt111

[dos8dos]

^SACRIFICE is indeed the operative word, but never the DIGNITY of our nation

[camiar]

and it is precisely our trust in our own that shows we are not impartially looking at the situation. if we can "initially assume" one scenario, why can we not initially assume a different scenario? i did. and took heat for it. but if one explanation makes so much more sense than any other, then why is the alternate explanation so offensive to some? true, ramming, like you said, is a serious threat. i've held that the attempt to ram is not, because it is difficult to ascertain just what a boat is trying to do. he could've been maneuvering clumsily and looked, for a while, like he was about to ram the pcg. so, until the investigation ascertains that there was cause to believe this, no one can say with any certainty whether (1) the pcg was truly under threat or not, (2) justified in opening fire, whether warning shots over the bow or disabling shots to the rudder or engine.

I do not claim being impartial about this incident. I am biased in favor of the Philippines. It is the same way if I learn that my son got into a fight with another kid, I would initially assume that my son had a very good & justifiable reason to do so.

 

When I said “we should initially assume that they were indeed under attack, or were taking active measures to counter a "clear and present danger"…” , it is logical reasoning on my part based on the fact that our PCG men are trained military personnel. They do what they are trained to do. They have rules of engagement to follow. Military personnel strictly follow rules of engagement because their career and their very lives depend on it. In this particular incident, it is out of character if they fired without themselves being under attack or without being in a life-threatening situation.

 

Assuming a different scenario may look impartial to you, but for me, illogical.

 

The Navy and PCG personnel, I can assure you, can tell the difference between clumsy maneuvers and ramming maneuvers. There is really no difference between ramming and “an attempt at ramming”, in the same manner as you would treat murder and attempted murder.

Edited May 28, 2013 by camiar

[heatseeker0714]

the taiwanese killed was the captain right,

 

should we be apologetic, DEFINITELY NOT. this incident is only REGRETABLE & thats it

 

Nope... He was the chief engineer. His son was the captain.

 

Should we be apologetic? YES, 110% begging in the knees apologetic, but to the Taiwanese PEOPLE as our letters of apology has stated, not the Taiwanese "GOVERNMENT" which Mr. Ma demands because he knows if our government gives in to his demand that we apologize to their "GOVERNMENT", that's already a De Facto recognition on our part that they are a separate entity (Independent Nation) from Beijing. I don't give a rat's a$$ if we piss of Taiwan's de facto government. The way i see it, in a couple of decades, they'll be back in Beijing's fold. I would rather have Taipei harrassing us for the forseeable future than Beijing.

[heatseeker0714]

I heard on the news the other day that PNoy was open to the idea of entering into an agreement with Taiwan on the issue of fishing. The following day, the Taiwanese government swore to arrest those responsible for violently attacking Filipinos. Then today, there was news footage showing Taiwanese police providing "protection'' for Filipino workers.

 

I couldn't help but correlate PNoy's statement with Taiwan's sudden about face stance from hostile to suddenly protective.

 

That fu@#in9 id.iot. The bare essence of a fishing agreement is that people from one place can fish in the other guy's waters and vice versa. The Taiwanese are salivating to ink said agreement with us because of one simple fact. They've overfished their waters and want our resources.

 

Dear Mr. Abnoy, please, pray tell, what the Filipino fisherman can get in Taiwanese waters???? it'll be a lopsided agreement in favor of them. That's why you don't hear of any Filipino fishermen deliberately going to Taiwanese waters... because there's almost nothing to fish. The only Filipino fishermen that stray into their waters are the unlucky folks who's boat's engines malfunctioned ang got rescued by the Taiwanese Coast Guard Administration.

 

Have any of you ever heard about Filipino poachers in Taiwanese waters???? :wacko: :wacko:

[sonnyt111]

That fu@#in9 id.iot. The bare essence of a fishing agreement is that people from one place can fish in the other guy's waters and vice versa. The Taiwanese are salivating to ink said agreement with us because of one simple fact. They've overfished their waters and want our resources.

 

Dear Mr. Abnoy, please, pray tell, what the Filipino fisherman can get in Taiwanese waters???? it'll be a lopsided agreement in favor of them. That's why you don't hear of any Filipino fishermen deliberately going to Taiwanese waters... because there's almost nothing to fish. The only Filipino fishermen that stray into their waters are the unlucky folks who's boat's engines malfunctioned ang got rescued by the Taiwanese Coast Guard Administration.

 

Have any of you ever heard about Filipino poachers in Taiwanese waters???? :wacko: :wacko:

So the Taiwanese got what they wanted all along because of the knee jerk reaction of Malacanang. Can a future president rescind this agreement?

[sonnyt111]

Good idea, but too idealistic. Not going to happen. With all the drama and excuses the Pinoy has, kakasuhan lang ng human rights violation and government. Looking beyond your own interests and the interests of one's family for the greater good is "taboo" in Filipino culture. Chances are what JFK said about "ask not what your country can do for you, but what you can do for your country", is the most ridiculous thing ever heard in out culture. besides, sacrifice is extraordinarily cruel. If you ask the Pinoy to sacrifice, he can no longer buy expensive smartfones, expensive clothes, ipads, cars, expensive gimmicks, and a whole lot of other stuff to make him/herself good and dignified and impress his/her neighbor's with stuff he doesn't really need. hehehe.

Yeah I don't think patriotism is even in the vocabulary of most Filipinos. Many associate speaking in Tagalog as being patriotic. That's the extent of it.

[Bugatti Veyron]

(OFF TOPIC) Well the "proud pinoy syndrome" is patriotic daw. Proud Pinoy Syndrome requires you to think similar to NAZI Germany where the Pinoy is the superior race. Bobo Arabo, Bobo Intsik, Bobo Kano, Bobo lahat except Pinoy. Just listen to your OFW's coming home, or everytime a pinoy wins Ms. Universe, American Idol, etc. We are the superior Aryan master race (nevermind where the proud pinoy advocates got that from)

Just replying to your off-topic post. Hinde naman siguro ganyan tayo mag isip. Of course Filipinos will be proud that a homegrown Filipina wins the Miss Universe title. Or a homegrown Pinoy wins a world boxing title. There's nothing wrong with that.

 

But to refer to Jessica Sanchez as Filipina and especially after seeing her sing the Star Spangled Banner, I'm hard pressed to accept people's remarks that she's Filipina. Sure she has some Filipino blood running through her veins. I have Scottish blood running through my veins but I am a Filipino and proud of that. And the Scots would never in a million years call me a Scot.

 

Now when I see the Philippine Askals, who are dominated by foreigners, but who may undoubtedly have some Filipino blood running through their veins, I have mixed emotions. Sure they represent the Philippines. I'm happy when the team wins. But I would be even happier if the team were composed of homegrown boys. Never mind if we lose. At least the team is made up of real homegrown pinoys.

Edited May 28, 2013 by Bugatti Veyron

[oscartamaguchiblackface]

Imagine, if China can hack into the designs of America's most sensitive and advanced weapons systems, despite all the levels of cyber security it employs in protecting these top military secrets, think what they can do to the Philippines' military "secrets." If they want to know anything about our government, no matter how secure the government thinks the data are, the Chinese will surely find out somehow. Heck, they may even mess up our banking and financial system, leading to chaos.

 

They don't even have to use their military. I think in the 21st century, battles will be waged and won in cyberspace.

 

http://news.yahoo.co...-133849940.html

Edited May 28, 2013 by oscartamaguchiblackface

[maxiev]

This may be a little off topic. Nevertheless, it gives one an insight into how modern day China expects their citizens to behave when they're overseas.

 

To be honest I'm impressed with this mindset.

 

http://news.yahoo.com/chinese-teen-defaces-egypt-temple-135035477.html

[heatseeker0714]

So the Taiwanese got what they wanted all along because of the knee jerk reaction of Malacanang. Can a future president rescind this agreement?

 

Let's wait and see... Abnoy said he was "open" to the idea of an "Agreement", depends on the body of the agreement. With regard to agreements such as these, they usually have a renewal date... depende na lang kung gaano katagal yung effectivity nung kasunduuan...

[heatseeker0714]

A nice read.

 

COSTS OF CAPITULATION | Strategic implications of Philippine response in Taiwan crisis

 

By: Jose Antonio Custodio

 

Jose Antonio A. Custodio is a security and defense consultant having worked at private sector and government offices. He was a technical adviser for a US defense company working for the US Pacific Command. He also specializes in military history and has post-graduate studies in history from the University of the Philippines.)

 

Since BFAR vessels are usually made of fiberglass, the consequences of a ramming attack would most likely be lethal to it.

 

 

 

Just got a confirmation from some of my Boks at the PCG that DA-BFAR Monitoring, Control and Surveillance Vessel 3001's hull is made out of Reinforced Plastic Glass a.k.a. FIBERGLASS...

 

Said DA-BFAR boats were given to us by Spain as ODA's during the early 2000s. 10 were 30 meters long and 4 were 11 meters long... An attempted ramming if proven, by a 15 meter WOODEN boat on a 30 meter FIBERGLASS boat despite the length disparity would indeed result in disastrous consequences for the FIBERGLASS boat.

 

Meron na naman tinamaan ng bolta-boltaheng kuryente jan... Pwede ng maging model ng Meralco... ;)

[jacuzzi]

Malabo manyari yan dito. Mahina concept ng self blame ng Pinoy. Its always someone elses fault.

 

 

 

You should read the biography of Manuel Quezon. As president he visted the Bilibid Prison and talked to the captives. Most of them denied committing a crime. Then he saw a quiet detainee and asked what happened. The person admitted to a crime and wished that given a chance he would never do that again. Thus Quezon gave him presidential pardon.

 

 

 

 

Apparently GUILTY people would never admit their mistakes.

 

 

 

[Bugatti Veyron]

http://ph.news.yahoo...-211025826.html

 

worse comes to worst, I hope these soldiers will demonstrate that Pinoy pride is way beyond Ms. Universe, American Idol, Manny Pacquaio, and other petty and shallow things that are current culture is so proud of.

Yes I wish Pinoy pride would step up a notch or two. You're right. The things we Pinoys are so proud off are quite petty.