PacMan's Corner

[0range1]

I have said enough about the fyt and will not go back and forth about it.

 

Re: Ronnie Nathanielz.

 

Yes, it is discrimination if you attack him by basis of his ethnic or national origin. This aspect has nothing to do with Boxing (our topic at hand), it is more of a low blow at personal attack.

 

If you wish to criticize RN, you can do so. I must say though that trying to discredit him by pointing out his origin is thinking backwards, and distasteful.

 

Discrimination is an attitude against another simply becos that person comes from somewhere else or belongs to another group. So you asking if a pinoy calling another pinoy is discriminatory? It is not. Same as black homies calling another 'niggers'. It is not the same for whites to call blacks "niggers' though right? That is the same with you calling RN Sri Lankan. That is simply racist and insulting, and of course we dont want to do that.

 

You will understand all of this when you go abroad and when you are discriminated yourself.

 

Now, I understand your comments against RN stemmed out from the rumours that he hurled against Manny. They may or may not be true.

 

Let me just say this, RN is a man who has done alot of contributions not only for Philippine Boxing, but also for the whole of Philippine Sports. He is an addition to the lack of sports contributors d2 satin. Hopefully, we stop alienating and treating him like second class.

 

He did an honest to goodness work on Paq-Marquez 2 anyway.

[djrs]

@Orange1

 

kinakampihan/pinaniniwalaan mo lang kasi eto e..

 

Donaire, Nathanielz, Recah Trinidad, Ring Magazine..

 

si donaire nga Gave Marquez the First Round e... 10-9 for Marquez!

 

ang nakakatawa pa dun e yung tatlong OFFICIAL JUDGE gave it 10-9 for MANNY!

 

tapos pinanood namin sa HBO-PPV at Solar Sports... sa HBO-PPV MALINIS NA PANALO SI Pacman sa Round 1 isa lang ang solid na suntok na pinasok ni JMM kay MP sa Round1 hahahahha...

 

Ika nga nung commentator sa HBO yung mga suntok ni JMM kay MP puro Half PUNCH na sa Glove lang tumatama then wala ng power pag tumama kay pacman...

 

 

ORANGE1=ROUND 1 mo diba kay Marquez? hahahahhahaha.

[jerzz]

tapos na yung jmm at mp

 

maski anong away pa gawin dito, panalo na si Manny hindi na mababago yun.

 

lets talk about diaz vs pacquiao

[0range1]

DJRS:

 

I have said enough about the fyt. It is nice to rehash all of these things again, pro sa tingin ko this has been dragged too far.

 

All I am saying is that JMM has made an overall nice performance that makes him more deserving of an immediate rematch. The results are disputed. I thought Marquez won. And the best that, JMM should get is another crack at Manny.

 

As a fan, I'd like to know who is the better fyter bet Manny and Juan. There is a demand for a 3rd fyt and I believe Marquez and a $6M offer is ready. C Pacman na lang ang hini hintay.

 

I have made it clear that I wasn't knocking Manny down. He won, it was a hard fought battle. I still am a fan, and I will continue to be a fan. My opinion is solely to see a 3rd fyt.

 

Also again, regarding Ronnie Nathanielz, you can choose to criticize him. You can do so. IF you do however, please let us not bring about racist comments. It would be a better discussion f things r talked on the context of Boxing, at wlang mga side comments na degrading.

Edited March 21, 2008 by 0range1

[djrs]

I thought Marquez won. And the best that, JMM should get is another crack at Manny.

 

Si RN nga lagi may Side comments e... hehehehehehhe.

pati nga si NINOY AQUINO binanatan nya din dati.. ehehehehhee.

 

ohh. and by the way this thread is about MP winning the fight..

 

maghintay ka lang mangyayari yun 3rd fight mo... after MP vs. Diaz..

 

then fight sila sa 135lbs..

 

-Di pa pala convincing na 4X bumagsak si JMM sa 24rounds nila..

 

-DI papala convincing na umamin na yung Judge nung Game 1 na nagkamali sa scoring..

 

-Di pa pala convincing na morethan 4X Low Blow(Hip-Shots) ang natanggap ni Pacman kay Marquez sa Last fight pero no point deduction!

 

-Di pa pala convincing sayo na Round 1 e KAY PACMAN according sa 3 OFFICIAL JUDGES? (i am willing to give you a copy of HBO bilangin mo kung ilan ang pumasok na suntok ni pacman! lamang na lamang sya sa rd.1)

 

-Di pa pala convincing na yung CUT ni Marquez sa Taas ng Mata e SUNTOK ni PACMAN! (i can prove it to you may CD

ako ng laban nila mas malinaw at kitang kita ang mga suntok)

 

-Di pa pala convincing yung 2nd Knockout na humawak sa ROPE si JMM nung 3rd Round e hindi nakita ni BAYLESS na dapat automatic 10-7 Round yun.

 

-Di pala convincing na ilang BESES din Na staggared si Marquez sa LABAN. pero si pacman 1-2X lang.

 

 

==

 

kasi ang convincing sayo siguro KO ni pacman si marquez.. alam mo naman kung gaano ka tindi conditioning ni Marquez duh?!

 

tanong ko sayo ano ba ang CONVINCING WIN sayo?

[pogi_cute]

manny should learn to be humble. overall, talo sya. wag sya masyadong mayabang. e wasak nga ang mukha nya e at masakit ang katawan nya di ba? he should just thank god na pinalusot sya.

[djrs]

@Orange1

 

eto basahin mo ha?

 

Click the link.

Why Castigate MP?

[djrs]

manny should learn to be humble. overall, talo sya. wag sya masyadong mayabang. e wasak nga ang mukha nya e at masakit ang katawan nya di ba? he should just thank god na pinalusot sya.

 

PROVE IT NA TALO SYA OVERALL. hahahahaha.

 

asan wasak na mukha?

 

nagyabang ba sya?

 

hindi GOD ang nagpalusot dyan..

 

kaya nga may OFFICIAL FIGHT JUDGES E.

 

another Manny HATER.

 

talo ka siguro sa pustahan.

Edited March 21, 2008 by djrs

[denizgonzalez]

Ok. This is a LEGITIMATE observation. But let me explain something. First let me tell you that I worked as a sports reporter/writer some time ago. And here is the thing. YOU HAVE TO BE THERE to know what really went on. Those "spectacular punches" by JMM? Might have looked good on TV, but may NOT have any power from the vantage point of a judge sitting by the ringside. This is PRO-BOXING. Scoring punches are worth dick. Judges look at how JMM/Manny reacted to the punches of the other. Damage report? JMM was on the brink of getting knocked-out. Sure, there was a brief time when Manny looked groggy too. But bottomline is, JMM was more damaged than Manny.

 

As for the "maraming naniniwala na si JMM nanalo", who gives a f#&k? This is not a democracy. The opinion of Recah Trinidad, Chino Trinidad, that assh*le sri-lankan trying to pass for a Filipino Nathanielsz ain't worth jack. Naniwala ba ang olympic body sa kanila when they protested Onyok being cheated? So why should we listen to these f#&kers now when they are doubting our own? As I've said before, only the opinion of 3, the judges, count. And 2 of 3 says Manny won. So tough, JMM fans. Crying a river about it ain't gonna help your boy any.

 

Rematch? Again, sure! Pero, pila si JMM sa back of the line. Manny calls the shots. JMM NEEDS Manny. Manny doesn't need JMM. To the Recah Trinidad's who think this is still an unfinished business, let them suit up, earn a boxing career for themselves, and fight JMM all day and all night. Mga miron lang ang mga ogag na ito. Bakit pakikinggan ni Manny sila? Will Recah pay Manny 5 M USD should Manny get permanently injured? t#ang%na. Ang dali magka-opinion. They (and for a time, me) got paid by the column inch to write opinions out of our asses. But hell no. I NEVER ventured to tell anybody how to manage their careers.

hmm.. it maybe true that u were a sports writer/reporter some time ago.

 

but u dont talk like one, so i doubt it

[denizgonzalez]

@skitz,

 

amen to that.. same view here. hehehehehe.

 

hindi maraming naniniwala na panalo si pacman... maraming naloko ng SOLAR SPORTS at commentator lalo na si donaire... at maraming SARADO isip...

 

imagine sa scorecards ng tatlong judge sa RD.1 10-9 lahat sila na panalo si Pacman sa Round 1! tapos dito dami nag post na Round 1 daw kay Marquez.

 

pero pag pinanood mo sa replay ng HBO-PPV ang linaw linaw si pacman ang panalo sa round 1... mas maraming pumasok na suntok na malakas ang pumasok. morethan 10! kay marquez lesthan 10.

sarado isip.. hmm.. i wonder about that hehe

 

kaming mga ngssbi na nanalo si marquez tanggap namin na panalo si pacman kc msyadong close ang fight

 

kayong mga loyal supporters ni pacman hindi matanggap na may ngssbing pinoy na panalo si marquez ^^

[Eddy Syet]

@Orange1

 

eto basahin mo ha?

 

Click the link.

Why Castigate MP?

 

Just finished reading it! Nice! Pacquiao haters should read this! :thumbsupsmiley:

 

to quote some:

 

- First, the record will establish that both Pacquiao and Marquez gave their thumbs-up on the three judges who were assigned by the Nevada State Athletic Commission.

 

- Pacquiao, being the aggressor, threw more blows, 619 to 511 or a huge difference of 108. Some judges give a lot of credit to aggressiveness because after all, boxing is a combative sport.

 

- Third, the judges’ scorecards didn’t show major disparities. They scored the first round for Pacquiao – which The STAR did, too. They also scored the third, fourth and 10th for the Filipino. Additionally, they were unanimous in scoring the second, fifth, seventh, eighth and 11th rounds for Marquez.

 

- From the scorecards, it’s clear that the difference was in the knockdown that Pacquiao produced in the third round because it meant a 10-8 count or a two-point cushion. In a close bout, a knockdown could be the decider and it was in last Saturday’s fight.

 

- Don’t forget that Pacquiao should’ve won the first meeting by a split decision four years ago... So if you really think about it, Pacquiao has effectively beaten Marquez twice.

 

- Marquez is a tough opponent and because of his style, will always be difficult for Pacquiao to handle.

 

- There are so many other “could’ves” to cite but the fact is two of the three judges scored it for Pacquiao and he won, fair and square. Pacquiao earned the victory because he fought with the bigger heart, came back strong in the late rounds and every Filipino should be proud of his achievement in becoming the first Asian to win three world titles in different divisions. He bled for every one of his countrymen, he took Marquez’ hardest shots without backing down. You couldn’t ask anything more from a hero.

 

Very well said by Quinito "The Dean" Henson :thumbsupsmiley:

[MRyoso]

what do you guys mean when you say haters or blind followers?

 

ang definition ko kasi e yung hindi marunong mag acccept ng opinions ng iba at pumuputak ng parang hindi edukadong bata kapag hindi pareho ang pagiisip nila ng ibangposter at yakap paring ng yakap sa bayag ng idol nila.

 

maraming blind haters ni pacman at dinamita dito. maraming masyadong marunong. masyadong maraming satsat pero hindi naman mapatunayan. maraming daldal ng daldal na paulit ulit naman ang sinasabi.

 

kung hindi niyo kayag irespeto ang opinyon ng iba kung sino ang nanalo, wala nalang bastusan. iba ang tingin mo sa tingin ng iba.

 

kelangan bang kwestyunin kung tingin ko e nanalo si pacman si marquez?

[djrs]

sarado isip.. hmm.. i wonder about that hehe

 

kaming mga ngssbi na nanalo si marquez tanggap namin na panalo si pacman kc msyadong close ang fight

 

kayong mga loyal supporters ni pacman hindi matanggap na may ngssbing pinoy na panalo si marquez ^^

 

FIrst of all.. dimo sinasagot yung mga nakapost at di ka rin ata nagbabasa..

 

look at sir Legionnaire, binasa nya yung napost ko.. HINDI MO TANGGAP NA PANALO SI PACMAN kasi sabi mo nga:

 

1.not really, clearly u ddnt back read the forum enough, i wasnt saying that marquez SHOULD have won, i was saying that in my score card marquez won.

 

so ano pagkakaiba nya? CONTRADICTING DIBA? so masmagaling ka sa JUDGES? ahhahahaha. come on.. ano hihirit mo? DINAYA?

 

AKO ang dami ko ng POST dito I AM STILL ON FACT'S SIDE! kung nagbaliktad ang mundo kung si Marquez yung NANALO kung si PACMAN yungbumagsak sa 3rd Round.. baka si Marquez ang Pinagtatanggol ko...

 

PERO inulit ulit namin yung Palabas sa HBO-PPV malinaw na malinaw na nanalo si PACMAN na walang daya! WALANG MAFIA Involved! walang business involved..

 

e yung mga nagsasabi ng "I THOUGHT JMM won dahil panalo sa Scorecards nyo e panoorin nyo ulit"

 

even yung replay sa HBO-PPV pati SUNTOK MARIRINIG MO sa AUDIO napakalinaw kung GLOVES ang tinatamaan

[bluevodka]

TECHNICALLY, wala na dapat patunayan si Manny from JMM. Pacquiao got the best of him on both okasyons.

[uaeboy25]

so kung tanggap nila na panalo si pacman bakit nila ipopost ang scorecard nila? for what?

 

sa announcer i like kinito henson. he research to much bago sya magsalita. even the favorite food ng boxer. hindi opinion nya lang.

 

as he said before jmm is a boxing scienteist with no punching power compare to pacman. aasa sya sa score card but sorry. nahilo sya at nawala panga sya nung matapos ang round 3. kundi pa ititnuro ng referree kung saan ang corner nya muntik pa syang umupo sa corner ni pacman. natawa talaga ako nun kasi papunta sya sa corner ni pacman.

 

 

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Why castigate Manny?

SPORTING CHANCE By Joaquin M. Henson

Thursday, March 20, 2008

It is appalling to find some Filipinos casting doubt on the integrity of Manny Pacquiao’s win by split decision over Juan Manuel Marquez in Las Vegas last Saturday.

 

Like the sourgrapers in Marquez’ camp, they’re insinuating Top Rank chairman Bob Arum did a sleight of hand to protect his hefty investment in Pacquiao by loading the judges panel with personal choices. Marquez’ supporters claim the Mexican should’ve won because the punchstats show he landed more blows.

 

Allow me to raise three points to clear the air on this issue.

 

First, the record will establish that both Pacquiao and Marquez gave their thumbs-up on the three judges who were assigned by the Nevada State Athletic Commission. In fact, one original choice Bill Flaherty was replaced on Pacquiao’s instance because he is Roach’s family friend. He was subbed by Tom Miller, 48. The two other judges were veterans Duane Ford, 70, and Jerry Roth, 66, whose reputation for fairness is unassailable. Ford has been a judge since 1978 and Roth, 1982. They’ve been involved in major world title fights before so working last Saturday’s fight was not an unfamiliar experience.

 

Miller has been a judge since 1996. By the way, it was recently disclosed that in his personal scorecard, Flaherty scored it 114-113 for Pacquiao, the same as Miller. So the verdict would’ve been the same even if Flaherty had not been replaced.

 

* * * *

 

Second, it must be explained that punchstats are a summary of total blows thrown and connected, broken down into jabs and power shots. Just because a fighter connected more punches on an accumulated basis doesn’t necessarily mean he won. Remember that punchstats show totals from the start of the fight to the end and a bout is judged from round to round, not by an accumulation of blows landed.

 

For instance, a fighter may take a round with a comfortable margin and receive a 10-9 count from the judges. If his opponent wins the next round by a slim margin, he also receives a 10-9 count. If you total the punches connected in the two rounds, one fighter will have the edge. But in the judges scorecards, it will be dead even. That’s how it is in boxing. You judge round by round, not by an accumulation of total punches connected at the end of the fight.

 

In the punchstats for last Saturday’s fight, Marquez landed more blows, 172 to Pacquiao’s 157, and was more accurate, 34 percent to 25 percent. Pacquiao, being the aggressor, threw more blows, 619 to 511 or a huge difference of 108. Some judges give a lot of credit to aggressiveness because after all, boxing is a combative sport.

 

In terms of jabs, Pacquiao threw 314 to Marquez’ 201, but landed only one more, 43 to 42. The figures proved that Marquez didn’t really jab as much as he was supposed to, averaging less than four connections a round.

 

In power punches, Marquez landed 130 of 310 compared to Pacquiao’s 114 of 305. The difference of 16 in connections is insignificant, considering the length of the fight or 12 rounds.

 

It is therefore not accurate to base the outcome of a fight on punchstats which do not break down into rounds.

 

* * * *

 

Third, the judges’ scorecards didn’t show major disparities. They scored the first round for Pacquiao – which The STAR did, too. They also scored the third, fourth and 10th for the Filipino. Additionally, they were unanimous in scoring the second, fifth, seventh, eighth and 11th rounds for Marquez.

 

The judges differed only in scoring three rounds – the sixth, ninth and 12th. In the sixth, Miller and Roth gave it to Marquez and Ford to Pacquiao. In the ninth, Miller and Roth scored it for Pacquiao and Ford to Marquez. In the 12th, Ford had it for Pacquiao while Miller and Roth saw it for Marquez.

 

So the discrepancy in scoring was far from being an eternity. From the scorecards, it’s clear that the difference was in the knockdown that Pacquiao produced in the third round because it meant a 10-8 count or a two-point cushion. In a close bout, a knockdown could be the decider and it was in last Saturday’s fight.

 

If Pacquiao had not decked Marquez but won the third round anyway, it would’ve been a split draw just like the outcome in their first fight. If Marquez won the third round, he would’ve won by majority decision.

 

Don’t forget that Pacquiao should’ve won the first meeting by a split decision four years ago. Burt Clements, the judge who had it a draw, admitted he made a mistake in shortchanging Pacquiao by a point in the first round when Marquez went down thrice but under boxing rules, the scorecard couldn’t be altered after the fact.

 

So if you really think about it, Pacquiao has effectively beaten Marquez twice.

 

The problem with some Filipino fans is they’ve been spoiled by Pacquiao and expect nothing less than a spectacular knockout in each of his fights.

 

Marquez is a tough opponent and because of his style, will always be difficult for Pacquiao to handle. Pacquiao could’ve done more things to win convincingly last Saturday – he could’ve used the right hand more, he could’ve hit and spun like he did in the second and third Erik Morales fights, he could’ve cut the ring off with more authority on Marquez to close the distance between them, he could’ve jabbed more, he could’ve attacked the body more consistently, he could’ve used more lateral movement instead of insisting on coming forward linearly.

 

There are so many other “could’ves” to cite but the fact is two of the three judges scored it for Pacquiao and he won, fair and square. Pacquiao earned the victory because he fought with the bigger heart, came back strong in the late rounds and every Filipino should be proud of his achievement in becoming the first Asian to win three world titles in different divisions. He bled for every one of his countrymen, he took Marquez’ hardest shots without backing down. You couldn’t ask anything more from a hero.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------

 

post ko lang po kasi sa lahat ng nabasa ko well research to compare sa mganabasa ko na personal opinion ng mga blogs na naniniwala na si jmm ang nanalo.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------

entitled sa opinion tayo pero hindi entitled tayo na magresearch bago mmagpost though mas gusto ko tong dito sa mtc kesa blogs na nababasa ko.

 

masyado kasing pabibo yung sa mga blogs na as if matalino sila.

 

may isang blogs na nagpost ng sariling scorecard nya na nanalo si jmm tinanong ko kung naging boxing judge na ba sya kahit sa amature. nagsorry sya personnal opinion nya lang. so para saan pa ang post nya? its nothing but just an opinion. if i had a children i will not let them waste thier time just reading an personal opinion. then time will come his opinion is just a folklore.

 

 

no need to watch those boxing match very closed dadayain lang ang mata natin. statistic and boxing records na lang.