Pano Ba Paliitin Ang Tyan

[Olympus]

hmmmm.. got some point there.

so you think those we're misleading?

 

More of cryptic I would say.

 

eat less carbs, better fat, more protein.

 

I wouldn't say les carbs since carbs are needed to fuel the body, I'd say focus more on complex carbs and more fibrous carbs. not too much protein either since protein is the hardest to digest and therefore can be easily stored as fat i taken in excess amounts

 

do aero only bec u need to improve ur cardiovascular system; build stamina and endurance to allow u to lift heavier while doing so at shorter rest intervals and quicker pace.

 

I'd go with palakol's advice since it has been proven that anaerobix training builds up stamina better than steady state training

[Jourdan]

I wouldn't say les carbs since carbs are needed to fuel the body, I'd say focus more on complex carbs and more fibrous carbs. not too much protein either since protein is the hardest to digest and therefore can be easily stored as fat i taken in excess amounts

 

well, if one's fat, he should eat less carbs to lose weight, not just switch to better carbs. less carbs would force ur body to use body fat as fuel, ceteris paribus.

 

I'd go with palakol's advice since it has been proven that anaerobix training builds up stamina better than steady state training

 

have nothing against his advice. and I endorse HIIT wholeheartedly.

[Olympus]

well, if one's fat, he should eat less carbs to lose weight, not just switch to better carbs. less carbs would force ur body to use body fat as fuel, ceteris paribus.

 

he should eat less, period.

[Palakol]

well, if one's fat, he should eat less carbs to lose weight, not just switch to better carbs. less carbs would force ur body to use body fat as fuel, ceteris paribus.

i prefer low fat rather than low carb. fat's so damn hard to digest. it slows you down during high intensity training.

 

and try to avoid eating more than 25 grams of protein in one serving.

 

*mumbles to self* what is it with people and carbs? they act like characters from the devil wears prada.

Edited January 19, 2009 by Palakol

[Jourdan]

i prefer low fat rather than low carb. fat's so damn hard to digest. it slows you down during high intensity training.

 

and try to avoid eating more than 25 grams of protein in one serving.

 

*mumbles to self* what is it with people and carbs? they act like characters from the devil wears prada.

 

I said better fat...that would mean mono-unsat fats. ur body needs these when repairing cells. It's not just abt which is harder or easier to digest. u need ample supply of fat during recovery.

 

the upper limit on protein is 1g/lb body weight. u need protein to build muscles, particularly BCAAs like glutamine. Anything more this limit may be a waste (accdg to opinion of most scientists).

 

most carbs nowadays are evil. prior to the dawn of civilization, men are savages who feed mainly on meat and whole grains. Our bodies are not designed by nature to take in large volumes of processed fibreless carbs, which typify most carbs today. U eat more carbs and u risk being obese. How? our bodies are known to convert carbs to fat when they see carbs in excess. u take in more carbs than what u require for ur daily routine, including training and recovery, and u will surely grow bigger...fatter that is, regardless of whether that carb is high-fibre or low-glycemic. That's just how our bodies respond to carbs. Eat more than what u need, u grow. period.

 

As one cannot easily estimate the number of carbs he/she requires during the day, it's safer to be on the low side when slimming down.

[Palakol]

I said better fat...that would mean mono-unsat fats. ur body needs these when repairing cells. It's not just abt which is harder or easier to digest. u need ample supply of fat during recovery.

 

the upper limit on protein is 1g/lb body weight. u need protein to build muscles, particularly BCAAs like glutamine. Anything more this limit may be a waste (accdg to opinion of most scientists).

 

most carbs nowadays are evil. prior to the dawn of civilization, men are savages who feed mainly on meat and whole grains. Our bodies are not designed by nature to take in large volumes of processed fibreless carbs, which typify most carbs today. U eat more carbs and u risk being obese. How? our bodies are known to convert carbs to fat when they see carbs in excess. u take in more carbs than what u require for ur daily routine, including training and recovery, and u will surely grow bigger...fatter that is, regardless of whether that carb is high-fibre or low-glycemic. That's just how our bodies respond to carbs. Eat more than what u need, u grow. period.

 

As one cannot easily estimate the number of carbs he/she requires during the day, it's safer to be on the low side when slimming down.

i also said low fat, not no fat. else i'd piss away all my vitamins.

 

and sir olympus said better carbohydrates. i doubt that he meant that refined high GI low fiber stuff. it's also kind of difficult to eat in excess if you do focus on the "better" carbohydrates. you get too bloated (i actually tried this). try getting the recommended daily allowance of 300 grams of carbohydrates from wholemeal bread. that's about 20 slices. not only is it difficult to stuff that much bread down your throat, but you also take in 60 grams of dietary fiber. normally, you need about 20-30 grams. (diarrhea anyone?) on the other hand, most fats today are also "evil."

 

also notice that the body converts excess carbohydrates into fat. (you need an excess of about a kilo of carbohydrates to gain a pound of fat.) i am reluctant to directly ingest fat instead of ingesting an energy source that could be converted to fat.

 

the body's preferred energy source is also carbohydrates. you need it to keep your glycogen stores high, which in turn will keep you pushing during anaerobic training. you need to keep the intensity high in order for interval training to be effective. and i strongly believe that fitness is not just about calories in - calories out.

 

moreover, regarding that long post about aerobics, you do not "tone" muscles. muscles look how they look whatever you do. (try looking at a diagram of the human anatomy) you aren't "toned" or "ripped" because a layer of fat covers your muscles, making you look flabby and "untoned." you either focus on burning off that fat, or increasing the size of your muscles. there is no such thing as "toning."

[Jourdan]

i also said low fat, not no fat. else i'd piss away all my vitamins.

 

and sir olympus said better carbohydrates. i doubt that he meant that refined high GI low fiber stuff. it's also kind of difficult to eat in excess if you do focus on the "better" carbohydrates. you get too bloated (i actually tried this). try getting the recommended daily allowance of 300 grams of carbohydrates from wholemeal bread. that's about 20 slices. not only is it difficult to stuff that much bread down your throat, but you also take in 60 grams of dietary fiber. normally, you need about 20-30 grams. (diarrhea anyone?) on the other hand, most fats today are also "evil."

 

kind of difficult? so we're all in agreement that u DO EAT LESS carbs when slimming down. net effect is the same - u eat less carbs or u technically won't when u chose to switch to better carbs.

 

then again, y prescribe the less obvious choice to a fat boy? it's pretty straightforward to say "eat less carbs" than say "eat smart carbs" all the while implying that ultimately, u want the fat boy to ingest LESS carbs, overall.

 

also notice that the body converts excess carbohydrates into fat. (you need an excess of about a kilo of carbohydrates to gain a pound of fat.) i am reluctant to directly ingest fat instead of ingesting an energy source that could be converted to fat.

 

...which is pretty inconceivable to do in 1 day but not so in a week. if u'r net positive on caloric intake, u'll eventually build fat, no complex math required to get to that.

 

the body's preferred energy source is also carbohydrates. you need it to keep your glycogen stores high, which in turn will keep you pushing during anaerobic training. you need to keep the intensity high in order for interval training to be effective. and i strongly believe that fitness is not just about calories in - calories out.

 

agree that carbs are the preferred energy source...and which is y u should take less of it WHEN SLIMMING DOWN. If it's available, ur body will doubtlessly prefer carbs over something else. so take it out ur system for a while. get near ur ideal weight and then do the switch to a more balanced diet. not all training are created equal. it all depends on the goals. I thought the whole thread is abt how to slim down and get rid of the pot belly the most efficient way? if we're already talking abt healthy individuals who are into the whole getting lean and mean stage, then by all means, eat smart carbs and indulge in balanced diets. But was that the premise here?

 

also, on ur advocacy of HIIT, I agree in principle that indeed, it's more effective in increasing stamina. But I still won't recommend it to a fat slob with a goal to reduce his waistline. Advanced training such as HIIT requires a GOOD cardiovascular base, not to mention strong joints, ligaments, etc. I doubt that a fat slob have that. If he does have a good cardiovascular system like a healthy VO2 max level, he wouldn't be too concerned abt a fat belly.

 

and of course, fitness is not just abt net calories. but are we talking abt fitness in general or abt removing some inches off a waistline?

 

moreover, regarding that long post about aerobics, you do not "tone" muscles. muscles look how they look whatever you do. (try looking at a diagram of the human anatomy) you aren't "toned" or "ripped" because a layer of fat covers your muscles, making you look flabby and "untoned." you either focus on burning off that fat, or increasing the size of your muscles. there is no such thing as "toning."

 

thanks for the correction. though i think even professionals commit the blunder of saying "toning" muscles. it's a lay term that people in-the-know should understand as it is, a lay term.

[Olympus]

Here's the take, when you lower calories, you lower calories as a whole, not just carb calories.

 

Anyone and everyone I know who focused on eating more low GI carbs without really lowering their total carb intake actually managed to lean out a bit faster with just that simple switch.

 

The next switch was to switch over to more lean sources of protein and better sources of fat.

 

Once that has been achieved, then one can start dropping the calories.

 

also, on ur advocacy of HIIT, I agree in principle that indeed, it's more effective in increasing stamina. But I still won't recommend it to a fat slob with a goal to reduce his waistline. Advanced training such as HIIT requires a GOOD cardiovascular base, not to mention strong joints, ligaments, etc. I doubt that a fat slob have that. If he does have a good cardiovascular system like a healthy VO2 max level, he wouldn't be too concerned abt a fat belly.

 

theory is different from application. HIIT for an advanced individual is of course different from a sedentary guy.

 

A simple light jog is already a high intensity workout for someone more than 20 lbs overweight.

[Jourdan]

Here's the take, when you lower calories, you lower calories as a whole, not just carb calories.

 

Anyone and everyone I know who focused on eating more low GI carbs without really lowering their total carb intake actually managed to lean out a bit faster with just that simple switch.

 

Yes, making the switch would equate to lower calories simply bec. of what Palakol has just said...it's just so damn hard taking a lot of high-fibre carbs.

 

But y not make it much more simpler by lowering total carb intake, regardless of whether it's high-fibre or low? like eating carbs 2-3 hrs right before your training, which is when u really need carbs?

 

and i agree that lowering calories concerns the total input, not just carb calories...but of the 3, which are often on the surplus? take a sample of what a fat slob eats and carb would most likely be 80-90% of the total caloric intake. so if I use pareto rule, which of the 3 major group should I slash? easy...carbs.

 

In fact, I dare say, take out the carbs from a fat boy's diet and for sure, he'll lose weight significantly in 2 wks time...all without lifting a single dumbbell and without doing a minute on the threadmill.

 

insulin levels will fall. body will react to starvation by using fat reserves. u will lose water. that's just basic biology at work.

 

sure, it's not healthy...but if one's mentally/psychologically up to the task, and he/she wants a quick way to lose weight, keeping in mind that he shall eventually go for a healthier diet + training combo once he gets nearer his/her target weight, then the no-carb "crash" diet will do wonders.

 

The next switch was to switch over to more lean sources of protein and better sources of fat.

Once that has been achieved, then one can start dropping the calories.[/

 

I think this should be concurrent with a slash in one's carb's intake. Y take them in strides?

 

theory is different from application. HIIT for an advanced individual is of course different from a sedentary guy.

 

A simple light jog is already a high intensity workout for someone more than 20 lbs overweight.

 

R u saying a fat boy punctuates his "light jog" with "walking" (something less of a light jog) to give his cardiovascular system a break? And this should improve his stamina better than a steady-state "lighter jog" (whatever that means)?

 

It's a play of words to me. For fat boys, u don't go for HIIT. u start on steady slow pace. improve ur VO2 max levels, ur heart rate rate-of-rise gradually while going easy on the joints. Get ur body to adapt to the change in neural activity as well. Start from 10-15 mins, progressing to 20-30 mins. If one has improved VO2 max level to what is deemed "average", then one can start doing HIIT meaninfully, like teasing ur heart to go for 80-90% of ur nominal max heart rate.

 

Interval training is not for the weak of hearts. You know this very well. No amount of re-definition can make it safer for a sendentary obese individual trying to lose weight.

[Olympus]

But y not make it much more simpler by lowering total carb intake, regardless of whether it's high-fibre or low? like eating carbs 2-3 hrs right before your training, which is when u really need carbs?

 

Since its the wrong thing to do and people often mess it up

 

and i agree that lowering calories concerns the total input, not just carb calories...but of the 3, which are often on the surplus? take a sample of what a fat slob eats and carb would most likely be 80-90% of the total caloric intake. so if I use pareto rule, which of the 3 major group should I slash? easy...carbs.

 

You'll be surprised that it is not always carbs that is the surplus. Protein is also usually a surplus, and converts to fat easier since it is harder to digest

 

In fact, I dare say, take out the carbs from a fat boy's diet and for sure, he'll lose weight significantly in 2 wks time...all without lifting a single dumbbell and without doing a minute on the threadmill.

 

point taken but haven't you ever noticed how anyone who significantly cuts carbs is always tired, irriitable and lethargic, yet never manages to keep the weight off permanently and usualy gains it back faster??

 

I think this should be concurrent with a slash in one's carb's intake. Y take them in strides?

 

because drasticaly doing things never works, slowly easing it in prevents your body from adapting and making your body store fat.

 

R u saying a fat boy punctuates his "light jog" with "walking" (something less of a light jog) to give his cardiovascular system a break? And this should improve his stamina better than a steady-state "lighter jog" (whatever that means)?

 

yes. Alternating a jog with a walk for interval training is already more than enough to give a fat person a good workout, yet not traumatize him or put himself at risk.

 

It's a play of words to me. For fat boys, u don't go for HIIT. u start on steady slow pace. improve ur VO2 max levels, ur heart rate rate-of-rise gradually while going easy on the joints. Get ur body to adapt to the change in neural activity as well. Start from 10-15 mins, progressing to 20-30 mins. If one has improved VO2 max level to what is deemed "average", then one can start doing HIIT meaninfully, like teasing ur heart to go for 80-90% of ur nominal max heart rate.

 

Interval training is not for the weak of hearts. You know this very well. No amount of re-definition can make it safer for a sendentary obese individual trying to lose weight.

 

Its not a play of words. I've used interval training on at least 500 people already and those who stayed within their capacity while slowly building up the intensity, not the duration actually lost a lot of weight.

 

I don't know why you continue to try arguing when most of these things you point out are more often just theoretical and something magazines, whose only objective is supplement sales, keep saying??

[Palakol]

kind of difficult? so we're all in agreement that u DO EAT LESS carbs when slimming down. net effect is the same - u eat less carbs or u technically won't when u chose to switch to better carbs.

nope. i'm trying to point out that it is difficult to eat too much.

 

and suddenly, we're into weight loss. for weight loss, i can personally slash 10 percent of my bodyweight in a day. just like that. of course, that's not healthy. but we are talking about weight loss, not health, aren't we?

 

i don't know what you have against low fat diets. honestly, i don't know what the hell you are arguing for. we can all use our different approaches for all i care.

 

here is the main idea for you lurkers:

 

eat clean.

 

it's that simple. (may also translate to "eat better.")

 

also, the level of intensity varies from individual to individual. fat boy will more likely be able to complete four 3-minute runs (with 2 minute walks in between) than a 20 minute jog. i know. i've been there.

Edited January 21, 2009 by Palakol

[Olympus]

eat clean.

 

it's that simple. (may also translate to "eat better.")

 

this is actually the simplest and often the most effective solution

[simplejoys]

hehehe... actually this is what i did. and more physical activities too!

badminton, biking and playing with my dog.

 

 

this is actually the simplest and often the most effective solution

[machme]

get into sports and do some situps..

[cool_stud1213]

less food intake, more fluids and fruits...

 

engage in sports.....

 

:thumbsupsmiley:

[iker3091]

problem ko din ito ang hirap paliitin tapos ang bilis bilis lumaki!

[Google]

i managed to remove an inch and a half from my belly and 5 pounds after two weeks. eto ginawa ko:

 

- 30 minutes cardio where heart rate is at 70% recommended for my age.

- light but high repetition weights (e.g. 15 reps 2 sets dumbell press at 25 pounds, instead of the 8 reps 3 set of 60 pounds i was doing two years ago when i was bulking up)

- cut rice intake to half.

- frequent light snacking

- water instead of iced tea and softdrinks.

[Darkangel01]

nica thread. hirap nga mag paliit ng tyan pag lumaki na. pero db kailangan din tlga ng disiplina if you really want na lumiit ung tyan, kasi ako medyo my pag ka tamad ako i managed to cut my rice intake from 3 to 2 and now im trying to cut it again from 2 to 1 pero hirap mag exercise hehe hingalin kasi ako, any solution para mawala ung pag ka hingalin, right now im taking 1500ml of vitamin C hindi ko naman alam kung ano pang dapat ko itake para maging strong ung lungs ko kaya wala ganun pa din laki tyan pa din.

[Palakol]

- frequent light snacking

- water instead of iced tea and softdrinks.

great strategy. i second the motion.

[rys]

lost 3 inches off my waist (within 3months)dahil sa calorie counting at push jerks

[JayZip]

great strategy. i second the motion.

 

 

same here...really effective strategy...

plus i do at least 100 situps a day.

[kads]

less food more exercise

[Sazzygurl]

You set up in the morning

[^Tim^]

You set up in the morning

 

set up what ma'am? anything in particular?

 

nweis, given up on mah tummy long time ago or maybe am tryin' again...

 

they say mo' pushups... or situps... mo' time in the gym...

 

but can only do one thing... play basketball on weekends so maybe that can help... even a bit...

Edited March 11, 2009 by ^Tim^

[vcm643]

sit up plus leg raise.... best done with heart rate up (ie like after doing cardio)...