South China/West Philippine Sea

[sonnyt111]

Though this thread deals with the South China/West Philippine Sea, I think it's appropriate to post this article here because of the similarities between the territorial claims of China in North East Asia and its claims here in South East Asia. Japan and the Philippines seem to be taking the fight to the Chinese with the backing of the USA.

 

http://news.yahoo.com/chinas-booming-military-spending-belies-caution-032225697.html

 

 

China's booming military spending belies caution

http://l.yimg.com/os/publish-images/news/2013-08-26/d19448d6-6aaa-4359-a768-eadacf5fbca9_afp-gif_new.gif By Kelly Olsen April 10, 2014 8:04 PM

Beijing (AFP) - With the world's biggest military, China far outnumbers rival Japan in manpower, ships, aircraft and defence spending, but analysts say underlying weaknesses leave it still wary of a fight.The two Asian powers are embroiled in simmering territorial and historical rows, with the tensions highlighted this week in consecutive visits to each by US Defense Secretary Chuck Hagel.

 

Beijing's latest double-digit rise in its defence budget, announced last month, will only increase its numerical superiority, but Japan enjoys technological and training advantages, and the key asset of a US security umbrella.

 

Hagel reiterated Washington's support for Tokyo while criticising Beijing in blunt exchanges with top People's Liberation Army (PLA) generals.

 

China, for its part, told the Vietnam War veteran that sovereignty over islands in the East China Sea at the heart of the dispute with Japan was non-negotiable and that it would "make no compromise".

 

Despite such tough talk, analysts say China's top strategists know an armed conflict, intentional or accidental, is not in their interest and could detract from their long-term goal of expanding their regional and global power.

 

"The Chinese high command has got to be very prudent and cautious in terms of the launch of any kind of military operation," said Arthur Ding, an expert on the PLA at Taiwan's National Chengchi University.

 

Even without the benefit of the US security alliance, Japan currently has better training, facilities and equipment, Ding said, although the long term situation was less clear.

 

"Right now Japan is in better shape," he told AFP.

 

Even Chinese President Xi Jinping has urged the military -- which is beset by corruption, with high-ranking officers under investigation -- to improve its abilities to "win battles".

 

- Huge leads -

 

The dispute over the uninhabited islands, administered by Japan as the Senkakus and claimed by China as the Diaoyus, has heated up since Tokyo bought islands in the chain from private Japanese owners in 2012.

 

Ships and aircraft from both countries, mostly dispatched by non-military maritime and coastguard agencies, regularly patrol the area.

 

In a tense incident early last year, however, Japan accused a Chinese frigate of directing its weapon-targeting radar at one of Tokyo's naval vessels, fuelling worries about a clash.

 

China's first aircraft carrier, the Liaoning, went into service 18 months ago and according to the International Institute for Strategic Studies' Military Balance 2014 report, published in February, the country's forces outnumber Japan in virtually all areas.

 

China had approximately 2.3 million active duty troops last year compared with Japan's 247,150, the report said. China also enjoyed huge leads in combat aircraft at 2,525 to 630, main battle tanks at 6,840 to 777 and tactical submarines at 66 to 18.

 

China's defence budget was $112.2 billion last year, while Japan's came to $51 billion, according to the report.

 

"The PLA is engaged in a modernisation programme fuelled by the country’s rapid economic development that has seen it surpass the armed forces of less developed countries in Asia," the report said.

 

It added, however, that China had shortfalls including a lack of combat experience, questions about training and morale, and weaknesses in command and control, anti-submarine warfare and other areas.

 

China's military "remains qualitatively inferior, in some respects, to more technologically advanced armed forces in the region -- such as South Korea and Japan -- and it lags far behind the US", the report said.

 

- Art of War -

 

Tokyo and Washington, once bitter wartime enemies, have had a close defence relationship since Japan's World War II defeat in 1945, with the US obligated to defend its ally if it is attacked.The US military has nearly 50,000 troops stationed in Japan at key strategic bases including on the southern island of Okinawa, a short flight to the disputed islands.

 

Kazuhisa Ogawa, a respected Japanese military affairs analyst, said that Japan's capabilities cannot be looked at as separate from those of the US.

 

"The Japanese military is not designed to stand on its own," Ogawa said, referring to its Self-Defense Forces.

 

"Japan is facing the Chinese military together with the US force, so it is nonsense to compare the capabilities of the Japanese military and the Chinese military without the presence of the US," he told AFP.

 

Though the Chinese Communist Party and state media regularly chastise Japan over the territorial dispute and accuse it of nascent militarism and denial of wartime atrocities in China, pronouncements by top officials can be more prudent.

 

In his exchanges with Hagel, China's defence chief Chang Wanquan suggested the country would not take pre-emptive action in the island dispute.

 

But Ogawa said Beijing had a clear strategy despite its reluctance to start an armed conflict.

 

"China is sending non-military ships to the area," he said, to assert its claim, gauge the reactions of Japan and the US, and show nationalistic elements at home it is flexing its muscles.

 

"China's policy is to win without a battle, taking the path of Sun Tzu's 'Art of War'."

 

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[sonnyt111]

https://ph.news.yahoo.com/vietnam-protests-chinese-oil-rig-disputed-sea-043104355--finance.html

 

 

Vietnam protests Chinese oil rig in disputed sea

HANOI, Vietnam (AP) — Vietnam demanded China stop oil drilling operations in a disputed patch of the South China Sea, saying on Monday that Beijing's decision to deploy a deep sea rig over the weekend was illegal.

 

China's move was the latest in a series of provocative actions aimed at asserting its sovereignty in potentially oil and gas-rich waters that have raised tensions with Vietnam, the Philippines and other claimants.

 

The United States shares many of the regional concerns about China's actions in the seas. Last week, President Barack Obama signed a new defense pact with the Philippines aimed at reassuring allies in the region of American backing as they wrangle with Beijing's growing economic and military might.

 

The China Maritime Safety Administration posted a navigational warning on its website advising that the CNOOC 981 rig would be drilling in the South China Sea from May 4 to Aug. 15, in an area close to the Paracel Islands, which are controlled by China but Vietnam claims as its own.

 

China's maritime administration also said that ships entering a 3-mile (4.8-kilometers) radius around the area are prohibited.

 

Vietnam's foreign ministry said the area where the rig was stationed lay within Vietnam's exclusive economic zone and continental shelf as defined by the 1982 U.N. Convention on the Law of the Sea.

 

"All foreign activities in Vietnam's seas without Vietnam's permission are illegal and invalid," the ministry said in a statement. "Vietnam resolutely protests them."

 

Vietnam's state-owned oil company, PetroVietnam, demanded that China National Offshore Oil Corporation "immediately stop all the illegal activities and withdraw the rig from Vietnamese waters."

 

Asked about Vietnam's objections, Chinese Foreign Ministry spokeswoman Hua Chunying said the drilling was taking place in Chinese waters.

 

Many analysts believe China is embarking on a strategy of gradually pressing its claims in the water by seeing what it can get away with, believing that its much smaller neighbors will be unable or unwilling to stop them. Vietnam has accused Chinese ships of cutting cables to its exploration vessels and harassing fishermen, as has the Philippines.

 

Chinese assertiveness puts Vietnam's authoritarian government in difficult position domestically because anger at China, an ideological ally, runs deep in the country. This is exploited by dissident movements, who accuse the government of being unwilling to speak out against Beijing.

 

Tran Cong Truc, the former head of a government committee overseeing the country's border issues, said the latest Chinese move was especially provocative.

 

"This act by China is much more dangerous than previous actions such as cutting the exploration cable or fishing bans," he said.

 

 

[camiar]

According to a pro-government Chinese newspaper, China will start fighting wars to acquire the disputed territories starting 2020.

 

follow this link:

 

http://www.ibtimes.com/china-engage-six-inevitable-wars-involving-us-japan-india-more-according-pro-government-chinese

 

----------------

Excerpts:

 

Over the next 50 years, the article expects China to be engaged in war over the following issues:

 

1. Taiwanese unification (2020-2025)

 

While China and Taiwan currently have fairly peaceful relations, the mainland continues to strive for “unification.”

 

2. South China Sea islands (2025-2030)

 

According to a translation of the original article, as published by StratRisk.com, following the inevitable "return" of Taiwan, “South East Asian countries” will “already be shivering.” This momentum will be the driving force behind negotiations to “reconquer” South China Sea islands like the Spratlys, which neighboring governments like Taiwan, Malaysia, the Philippines and Vietnam all lay claim to.

 

3. “Southern Tibet" (2035-2040)

 

Though China and India share a long border along China’s southwest region, a Himalayan area claimed as "southern Tibet" is the main point of contention between the two huge nations. The article suggests that “the best strategy for China is to incite the disintegration of India” by dividing the nation into several smaller countries so “India will have no power to cope with China."

 

4. East China Sea islands (2040-2045)

 

Unsurprisingly, the newspaper reaffirms that the East China Sea island groups of Diaoyu and Ryukyu, known in Japan as Senkaku and Okinawa, belong to China. While the article says the conflict won’t take place until 2040, other scholars have estimated that a war between China and Japan, and likely the U.S., could happen sooner.

 

5. “Outer” Mongolia (2045-2050)

 

“If Outer Mongolia can return to China peacefully, it is the best result, of course; but if China meets foreign intervention or resistance, China should be prepared to take military action,” the article reads.

 

6. “Recover the territory seized by Russia” (2055-2060)

 

The article recognizes the current good relations between China and Russia but insists that “China never forgets the lands lost to Russia” in past centuries, adding that “when the chance comes, China will take back the lands.” The article is predictably confident that all wars would be won by the Chinese side, and Russia is no different: “After the victories of previous five wars, it is time to make Russians pay the price.”

 

[Bugatti Veyron]

Anyone see the video of that Chinese ship which rammed a Vietnamese ship that tried to get too close to the oil rigs the Chinese have set up in the exclusive economic zone of Vietnam? The real reasons for China's aggression in the South China Sea/West Philippine Sea are becoming quite evident. It's to drill for natural gas/oil.

 

The Philippines' beef with China is over fishing rights. The challenge of the Vietnamese to stop oil drilling by the Chinese in its exclusive economic zone prompted a much more aggressive response from China.

 

How is the US supposed to maintain peace in the South China/West Philippine Sea without imposing sanctions on China? The blatant use of force by the Chinese against the Vietnamese clearly demonstrates how seriously China intends on imposing its will in this part of the world.

Edited May 8, 2014 by Bugatti Veyron

[airport-noo]

Tanong lang mga bossing: Are the uninhabitable islets near our shores, like Scarborough Shoal, Mischeef Reef, Reed Bank, etc. -- are they all part of the Spratlys? Kasi parang malayo sa mini-archipelago ng Spratlys.

[lomex32]

Chinese Fishing Vessel

 

Slaughtering Poor Pawikans

 

Pawikan shells - in the background PALAWAN mainland

 

Edited May 9, 2014 by lomex32

[oscartamaguchiblackface]

Chinese Fishing Vessel

 

Slaughtering Poor Pawikans

 

Pawikan shells - in the background PALAWAN mainland

 

A clear violation of Philippine laws. Problem is China does not believe Philippine laws applies to these seas because, according to them, they own the South China/West Philippine Sea. So they can indiscriminately k*ll endangered species unless the Philippine Coast Guard stops them. When that happens, China sends its warships to intimidate our Coast Guard.

 

Isn't the killing of endangered species part of international law? If so, we might as well ask the US Navy to enforce this. Bullies like China only respect adversaries more powerful than they are.

 

 

[heatseeker0714]

Tanong lang mga bossing: Are the uninhabitable islets near our shores, like Scarborough Shoal, Mischeef Reef, Reed Bank, etc. -- are they all part of the Spratlys? Kasi parang malayo sa mini-archipelago ng Spratlys.

 

 

Scarborough alam ko is not part of the spratly's... mischief yata is part of spratly's & reed ewan ko...

[airport-noo]

Scarborough alam ko is not part of the spratly's... mischief yata is part of spratly's & reed ewan ko...

Thanks. Sorry for the slight OT.

[airport-noo]

Chinese Fishing Vessel

 

Slaughtering Poor Pawikans

 

Pawikan shells - in the background PALAWAN mainland

 

 

I find it strange that China doesn't even mention the turtles. Same as last year with the pangolins. If they truly believed that they own the entire sea, wouldn't they at least show some concern for THEIR property? They don't seem to see themselves as the victims whose resources are being abused.

[maxiev]

Chinese Fishing Vessel

 

Slaughtering Poor Pawikans

 

Pawikan shells - in the background PALAWAN mainland

 

These photos are really disturbing.

[maxiev]

I find it strange that China doesn't even mention the turtles. Same as last year with the pangolins. If they truly believed that they own the entire sea, wouldn't they at least show some concern for THEIR property? They don't seem to see themselves as the victims whose resources are being abused.

I don't know if the turtles in the photo are the same turtles mentioned in this article:

 

http://news.yahoo.com/philippines-raise-china-dispute-asean-summit-102612671.html

 

Philippines to raise China dispute at ASEAN summit

Associated Press By OLIVER TEVES

 

SE Asia faces renewed unity test as South China Sea tensions

MANILA, Philippines (AP) — Philippine President Benigno Aquino III said Saturday that he would raise his country's territorial dispute with China at a meeting of Southeast Asian leaders and call for support to resolve the conflict through international arbitration.

 

In a statement issued before departing for the 24th Association of Southeast Asian Nations summit in Myanmar, Aquino said dialogue between two countries is not enough to settle issues that also affect others in the region.

 

The Philippines presented evidence in March to an international tribunal against China's sweeping territorial claims in the South China Sea, ignoring Beijing's warning that the case would damage bilateral ties.

 

Manila brought its territorial dispute with China to international arbitration in January 2013 after Chinese government ships took control of a shoal claimed by the Philippines.

 

"Let us uphold and follow the rule of law in resolving territorial disputes in order to give due recognition and respect to the rights of all nations," Aquino said in his statement. "We cannot rely just on dialogues between only two nations to settle issues that affect others in the region."

 

In addition to the Philippines and Myanmar, ASEAN also includes Brunei, Cambodia, Indonesia, Laos, Malaysia, Singapore, Thailand and Vietnam.

 

In the latest spat between the Philippines and China, Filipino maritime police arrested 11 Chinese fishermen who allegedly illegally collected more than 300 endangered marine turtles in a disputed shoal close to the western province of Palawan. Manila has ignored Beijing's demands to release the fishermen and their boat apprehended early last week by the police at the Half Moon Shoal.

 

Last month, Chinese coast guard vessels tried to stop Philippine marines from resupplying and bringing fresh troops to a grounded ship now being used as the country's outpost and symbol of sovereignty at the disputed shoal.

 

The Philippines could invite even stronger Chinese protests after the Department of Energy announced Friday that it was ready to accept applications to explore for oil and gas in the Reed Bank off Palawan. The area is near where Chinese patrol ships tried to drive away a Philippine exploration vessel in March 2011. A Philippine general deployed two air force planes, but the Chinese ships had left by the time the aircraft reached the contested area.

[Bugatti Veyron]

The Philippine government must remain firm and not give in to the demands of China to release the Chinese fishermen for violating Philippine laws.

 

http://news.yahoo.com/philippines-jails-chinese-fishermen-infringing-wildlife-law-064323972.html

Philippines jails Chinese fishermen for infringing wildlife law

http://l.yimg.com/a/p/us/news/editorial/d/0c/d0c3eb8ca18907492a4b337b5cec5193.jpeg 15 hours ago

View p

MANILA (Reuters) - The Philippines has jailed 11 Chinese fishermen caught with endangered sea turtles off a disputed shoal in the South China Sea, officials said on Saturday, rejecting demands from China to free the men.

 

The Philippine National Police on Tuesday intercepted a Chinese fishing boat carrying about 350 marine turtles off Half Moon Shoal in the Spratlys, arrested its crew and took them to the southwestern province of Palawan to face charges of violating wildlife protection laws.China has claims on the South China Sea, an area rich in energy deposits and an important passageway traversed each year by $5 trillion worth of ship-borne goods. Brunei, Malaysia, the Philippines, Taiwan and Vietnam also have claims on the area.

 

If found guilty, the fishermen, who were transferred to a provincial jail late on Friday, face prison terms ranging from 12 to 20 years. But each can post bail of 150,000 pesos ($3,400) to secure temporary liberty while facing trial.

 

"They will remain in detention until the office of the provincial prosecutor has determined whether there is probable cause for the filing of formal charges," said Allen Ross Rodriguez, a government lawyer.

 

China's embassy in Manila on Thursday sent a diplomat to Palawan to interview the fishermen and work for their early release. But authorities said they must go through the judicial process.

 

A panel of Philippine officials has to decide separately on charges of illegal entry after the fishermen were caught about 60 miles off Palawan, but within the country's exclusive economic zone.

 

China has demanded the release of the vessel and its crew, saying it has undisputed sovereignty over the area and adjacent waters in the South China Sea.

 

Tension is also rising in the Paracel islands after China parked its biggest mobile oil rig 120 miles off the coast of Vietnam, with each country accusing the other of ramming its ships in the area, in the worst setback for Sino-Vietnamese ties in years.

 

The incidents in the Paracel and Spratlys islands are likely to be taken up by Southeast Asian leaders who are due to hold an annual summit in Myanmar's capital on Sunday.

 

(Reporting by Manuel Mogato; Editing by Clarence Fernandez)

 

 

Edited May 10, 2014 by Bugatti Veyron

[camiar]

Tanong lang mga bossing: Are the uninhabitable islets near our shores, like Scarborough Shoal, Mischeef Reef, Reed Bank, etc. -- are they all part of the Spratlys? Kasi parang malayo sa mini-archipelago ng Spratlys.

Maps of the South China Sea / West Philippine sea disputed areas:

 

 

[sendero]

Do you think the Ab- Noy Administration has the balls to confront these arrogant and f#&king Chinese intruders in our territories? Suggest to send some Abu Sayaff, MILF/MNLF Lost Command to attack their detachments in the West Philippine Sea but give them compensation for their for their mercenary services. And then kidnap/ behead these intruders with the presence of foreign media such as CNN, BBC.