South China/West Philippine Sea

[wolflove_bigdawg]

Great Britain and Italy have recently retired their Tornados. How I wish they would play sta. klaus to us. what is junk to others maybe treasure to others. pilots who have the f-5's and the s-211 can easily adjust to it since tornados are 3rd gen only.

[jopoc]

Great Britain and Italy have recently retired their Tornados. How I wish they would play sta. klaus to us. what is junk to others maybe treasure to others. pilots who have the f-5's and the s-211 can easily adjust to it since tornados are 3rd gen only.

 

 

bilhin natin ng por kilo

[johnlove]

The PLA must be thinking: If the squatters and squat in Manila and get land in return, there is no reason why we can do it in the Spratly and Panatag.

Edited August 12, 2012 by johnlove

[johnlove]

Great Britain and Italy have recently retired their Tornados. How I wish they would play sta. klaus to us. what is junk to others maybe treasure to others. pilots who have the f-5's and the s-211 can easily adjust to it since tornados are 3rd gen only.

During the Sabah crises, Great Britain openly sided with Malaysia, I don't think they would give a damn about us.

[johnlove]

so i guess with or without those 2 old frigates, we are bound to be doomed anyway.

so why buy those junk? para lang masabi na meron?

At least we will not anymore be a 2 ship navy.

PLA has to shoot us 3 times in order to bring our navy down to it's knees.

Edited August 12, 2012 by johnlove

[tigertrap]

Great Britain and Italy have recently retired their Tornados. How I wish they would play sta. klaus to us. what is junk to others maybe treasure to others. pilots who have the f-5's and the s-211 can easily adjust to it since tornados are 3rd gen only.

 

Why get/buy 3rd Gen Fighters when you can get the a 4.5 Gen LIFT like the FA/TA50 of the Koreans?

 

 

At least we will not anymore be a 2 ship navy. PLA has to shoot us 3 times in order to bring our navy down to it's knees.

 

We have plans to get more, Rule of 3.

 

Talk with the Italians are in the finalization stages, and we will be getting 2 Maestrales class frigates from them and maybe a Minerva as a deal sweetener, unfortunately for our Armed forces, its was neglected for the past 25years and we concentrated on COIN and overlooked our ex.defs. Just because we dont hear anything about the modernization doesnt mean nothing is happening, In fairness to Pnoy, what he has done for the AFP in the past 3 years is far greater that what the Little Lady did in 9.

[dungeonbaby]

At least we will not anymore be a 2 ship navy.

PLA has to shoot us 3 times in order to bring our navy down to it's knees.

 

that's funny. we'll last 5 seconds longer.

[dos8dos]

our neighbors will NEVER respect us for the things WE DONT HAVE, hence chinas current treatment of filipinos

 

the biggest threat to our territorial claim is the chinese navy, i hope those refurbished cutters from the US & the upcoming frigates from the itialians will be retrofitted with anti-ship missiles soon

 

the biggest news that the chinese will take seriously is our acquisition of anti-ship missiles.

 

the chinese army is only a deterrent for those who wish to invade mainland china

[heatseeker0714]

our neighbors will NEVER respect us for the things WE DONT HAVE, hence chinas current treatment of filipinos

 

the biggest threat to our territorial claim is the chinese navy, i hope those refurbished cutters from the US & the upcoming frigates from the itialians will be retrofitted with anti-ship missiles soon

 

the biggest news that the chinese will take seriously is our acquisition of anti-ship missiles.

 

the chinese army is only a deterrent for those who wish to invade mainland china

 

Them ChiComs are the Biggest threat to our territory IN FRONT of us....

 

Guess who's the Biggest threat to our territoryBEHIND us...

 

I'll give you a clue... Said country's located between Canada and Mexico...

 

In the World stage, there's no permanent friends, just permanent interests... Just like politics...

[dos8dos]

^im not a fan of the americans, specially their EXPENSIVE weapons, but i would welcome any assistance from them

 

between america & china, i would choose america, their POLICY is much better for our sake

 

before i choose between the 2 WORLD POWERS, i would rather open closer ties with russia, france, australia, japan & south korea. its better for us to open up more alliance than US alone

[zenislev]

^im not a fan of the americans, specially their EXPENSIVE weapons, but i would welcome any assistance from them

 

between america & china, i would choose america, their POLICY is much better for our sake

 

before i choose between the 2 WORLD POWERS, i would rather open closer ties with russia, france, australia, japan & south korea. its better for us to open up more alliance than US alone

 

countries can sell us anything from used to brand new, as long as we have the dough to slap on their hands.

 

US Policy sounds good, but they always reserve a "catch" and does not lay all the cards on the table.

[dos8dos]

^china claims ALL of south china sea together with all the natural resources in it, this means china is offering us NOTHING coupled with a THREAT of use of BRUTE FORCE if we dare to defy them

 

while the americans will deal with us in a NOT so EQUAL FOOTING, but at least they would recognize our CLAIM to such territory & the minerals in it that they could harness. its only PRACTICAL to go with america no matter how modest the benefit well get from them, at the very least we get SOMETHING out of our CLAIM. we just have to be relegated with the fact that the americans need to recover their investments

Edited August 15, 2012 by dos8dos

[dungeonbaby]

^im not a fan of the americans, specially their EXPENSIVE weapons, but i would welcome any assistance from them

 

between america & china, i would choose america, their POLICY is much better for our sake

 

before i choose between the 2 WORLD POWERS, i would rather open closer ties with russia, france, australia, japan & south korea. its better for us to open up more alliance than US alone

 

really, you would rather ally with russia than the US? pardon the language but russia would f*ck our smooth lil bottom soon as we turned our back.

Edited August 15, 2012 by dungeonbaby

[wolflove_bigdawg]

Why get/buy 3rd Gen Fighters when you can get the a 4.5 Gen LIFT like the FA/TA50 of the Koreans?

 

 

 

 

We have plans to get more, Rule of 3.

 

Talk with the Italians are in the finalization stages, and we will be getting 2 Maestrales class frigates from them and maybe a Minerva as a deal sweetener, unfortunately for our Armed forces, its was neglected for the past 25years and we concentrated on COIN and overlooked our ex.defs. Just because we dont hear anything about the modernization doesnt mean nothing is happening, In fairness to Pnoy, what he has done for the AFP in the past 3 years is far greater that what the Little Lady did in 9.

 

one word: PRICE. the TA-50 costs around 28M dollars and as i have said, if those countries would play sta. claus, meaning they would offer them at bargain price. take note also that the Tornado is not a light fighter aircraft like the TA-50. they are full-sized fighter-bombers.

 

we should be vigilante about this creeping invasion by China. mukhang me balak gawing Falklands nila ang Panatag Shoal. another thing that should keep our eyes open is the psy-war being conducted by China. doble-kara tong mga chekwang ito. pa-traydor kung tumira. sana me paraan para makapag-ambagan tayo sa isang pondo pambili ng shore-based anti-ship and anti-aircraft missiles na may 500 km. range para hindi makalapit sa mga isla natin.

Edited August 27, 2012 by TheSmilingBandit

[zenislev]

^china claims ALL of south china sea together with all the natural resources in it, this means china is offering us NOTHING coupled with a THREAT of use of BRUTE FORCE if we dare to defy them

 

while the americans will deal with us in a NOT so EQUAL FOOTING, but at least they would recognize our CLAIM to such territory & the minerals in it that they could harness. its only PRACTICAL to go with america no matter how modest the benefit well get from them, at the very least we get SOMETHING out of our CLAIM. we just have to be relegated with the fact that the americans need to recover their investments

 

the US Government is on a win - win situation here, they sell old equipments for a hilariously high price, make a neutral stance while punching China with words, and shielding themselves with our islands.

 

why would they arm us? because our country is a shield against direct invasion from their precious Pearl Harbor.

 

China would not make an openly aggressive move, why? Nobody openly sides with them, many are pissed with them and praying some lunatic chinese general will push the trigger. They will not make a mistake by fighting a multiple front war with countries with so many allies, resources, and not to mention, with nuclear capability.

[tigertrap]

one word: PRICE. the TA-50 costs around 28M dollars and as i have said, if those countries would play sta. claus, meaning they would offer them at bargain price. take note also that the Tornado is not a light fighter aircraft like the TA-50. they are full-sized fighter-bombers.

 

Cost is indeed the main consideration, but we need a platform operable for the next 15 years, how many years and flying hours do you think the Tornado's have, assuming they play St.Nick and give us a very very bargain price we looked at the 2nd hand/ refurbished options YAKs, Kfirs, F16s and even F5s to name a few and it would be practical to get a new platform with our intended time frame/budget and skill gap.

 

I prefer we get the best, heck even an F22 raptor but we cant and if we still pursue the F16 route in the near future then the next best thing would be a TA or FA50

[wolflove_bigdawg]

Cost is indeed the main consideration, but we need a platform operable for the next 15 years, how many years and flying hours do you think the Tornado's have, assuming they play St.Nick and give us a very very bargain price we looked at the 2nd hand/ refurbished options YAKs, Kfirs, F16s and even F5s to name a few and it would be practical to get a new platform with our intended time frame/budget and skill gap.

 

I prefer we get the best, heck even an F22 raptor but we cant and if we still pursue the F16 route in the near future then the next best thing would be a TA or FA50

 

Exactly. because we can't afford those F-xx's, not only for their price but also for the maintenance cost. i believe the contract for the TA50's have been signed already and that partial delivery will be late 2013. Aircrafts if properly maintained can be operational for 50 years so 1975 + 50 = 2025. Actually, Saudi Arabia is still using the Tornados. The only reason Italy and GB are retiring these is the same reason rich people change cars every 3 years; because they can. They are moving up to Typhoon Eurofighters.

[tigertrap]

Exactly. because we can't afford those F-xx's, not only for their price but also for the maintenance cost. i believe the contract for the TA50's have been signed already and that partial delivery will be late 2013. Aircrafts if properly maintained can be operational for 50 years so 1975 + 50 = 2025. Actually, Saudi Arabia is still using the Tornados. The only reason Italy and GB are retiring these is the same reason rich people change cars every 3 years; because they can. They are moving up to Typhoon Eurofighters.

 

I agree, and we still need a real Fighters/interceptors with long legs, This is the main issue I dont like with the TA50s, its short leg.

 

Speaking of the Saudis, they are still fully utilizing its F5s in its inventory, goes to show that if particular platform is well handled it can last really long.

 

Yup, they are moving up to the EuroFighters, I think even the Dutch are planning to sell some from of its Wing Assets.

[heatseeker0714]

I agree, and we still need a real Fighters/interceptors with long legs, This is the main issue I dont like with the TA50s, its short leg.

 

Speaking of the Saudis, they are still fully utilizing its F5s in its inventory, goes to show that if particular platform is well handled it can last really long.

 

Yup, they are moving up to the EuroFighters, I think even the Dutch are planning to sell some from of its Wing Assets.

 

1.) The reason it has short legs is because it is primarily a Lead In Fighter TRAINER and a Light Combat Aircraft in its secondary role. Aircraft with primary roles as trainers don't usually have long legs.

 

2.) The main reason the Saudi's F-5s are still flying and ours are not is that aside from being lavishly maintained, they have other fighters in significant numbers to send up in the air to patrol their airspace, while we do not. In a nutshell, an aircraft's airframe can only take X number of hours of flying time before it is deemed unsafe by the manufacturer and or air force to use.

 

Cost is indeed the main consideration, but we need a platform operable for the next 15 years, how many years and flying hours do you think the Tornado's have, assuming they play St.Nick and give us a very very bargain price we looked at the 2nd hand/ refurbished options YAKs, Kfirs, F16s and even F5s to name a few and it would be practical to get a new platform with our intended time frame/budget and skill gap.

 

I prefer we get the best, heck even an F22 raptor but we cant and if we still pursue the F16 route in the near future then the next best thing would be a TA or FA50

 

Even if we had the dough to buy, operate and maintain F-22s, it's still a pipedream... US Federal Law currently forbids the EXPORT of F-22s to other countries. The only country who can buy, operate and maintain F-22s aside from the US in significant numbers and whom the US would probably agree to sell said bird is Japan, but because of the said law, they had to make do with F-35s. That's why the Japan Air Self Defense Force ordered the F-35. But knowing them Sushi Eaters, they would modify their F-35s the same way the Israelis do and will have a much more potent version than what the US and other F-35 Programme Partner Countries will be flying.

Edited August 27, 2012 by TheSmilingBandit

[wolflove_bigdawg]

even if we can buy the f22 and the US govt. allows its sale, malabo pa rin satin yan. baka mahilo mga piloto natin sa instrumentation, speed and G-force nyan. we are talking of 9G's here. ilang G's ba ineexert ng tora-tora? hehehe

[tk421]

I'm not a weapons or planes expert, but I read in an article that when it comes to dogfights, the F-22 loses. It's main strength is being stealthy at the cost of being agile.

 

If a battle does happen in that area, it will most likely be dogfights.

[dos8dos]

really, you would rather ally with russia than the US? pardon the language but russia would f*ck our smooth lil bottom soon as we turned our back.

 

russia have GOOD (not so expensive) DEFENSIVE weapons, and its not just russia that i mentioned because its in the BEST INTEREST of our nation to have more source of DEFENSIVE armaments

 

Even if we had the dough to buy, operate and maintain F-22s, it's still a pipedream... US Federal Law currently forbids the EXPORT of F-22s to other countries. The only country who can buy, operate and maintain F-22s aside from the US in significant numbers and whom the US would probably agree to sell said bird is Japan, but because of the said law, they had to make do with F-35s. That's why the Japan Air Self Defense Force ordered the F-35. But knowing them Sushi Eaters, they would modify their F-35s the same way the Israelis do and will have a much more potent version than what the US and other F-35 Programme Partner Countries will be flying.

 

japan developed its own 5th gen jet fighter after the US turned down their request to acquire F-22

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K4Ucjp9qJOg&feature=youtube_gdata_player

 

russia will soon export its 5th gen jet fighter (sukhoi T50 PAK FA), this could change the US foreign policy on F-22 as soon as north korea gets their stealth fighter from russia

 

really, you would rather ally with russia than the US? pardon the language but russia would f*ck our smooth lil bottom soon as we turned our back.

 

add to that the FACT that US FOREIGN POLICY PROHIBITS sale of STATE of ART armaments to countries with hideous HUMAN RIGHTS VIOLATIONS even if they are LONG TIME ALLY such as the PHILIPPINES

Edited August 27, 2012 by TheSmilingBandit

[heatseeker0714]

add to that the FACT that US FOREIGN POLICY PROHIBITS sale of STATE of ART armaments to countries with hideous HUMAN RIGHTS VIOLATIONS even if they are LONG TIME ALLY such as the PHILIPPINES

 

Saudi Arabia... Honor Killings galore and their primitive and crummy outlook on women...

 

Pakistan... Same with the Saudis plus the open Secret that their CIA, the ISI supports groups considered terrorists by the State Dept.

 

Iran before the Fall of the Shah...

 

Egypt... Hosni Mubarak's 30 year rule ring any bells???

 

Iraq during the 1980-88 war with Iran... this one takes the cake... Saddam was their poster boy of "Stability" in the 80s...

 

and a lot more...

 

hideous HUMAN RIGHTS VIOLATIONS my Novo Ecijano @$$... Ayaw lang talaga nilang makayanan natin tumayo totally sa sarili nating paa...

[wolflove_bigdawg]

para palang sniper ang f-22. pang long-range. pero syempre puputok pa rin pag nagkalapitan.

[dos8dos]

Saudi Arabia... Honor Killings galore and their primitive and crummy outlook on women...

 

Pakistan... Same with the Saudis plus the open Secret that their CIA, the ISI supports groups considered terrorists by the State Dept.

 

Iran before the Fall of the Shah...

 

Egypt... Hosni Mubarak's 30 year rule ring any bells???

 

Iraq during the 1980-88 war with Iran... this one takes the cake... Saddam was their poster boy of "Stability" in the 80s...

 

and a lot more...

 

hideous HUMAN RIGHTS VIOLATIONS my Novo Ecijano @$$... Ayaw lang talaga nilang makayanan natin tumayo totally sa sarili nating paa...

 

sometimes even with RIGHTEOUS america, PRINCIPLES are set aside by the LUSTER of BLACK GOLD. the americans know that the arabs have dismal HUMAN RIGHTS record but would be willing to look the other way specially for WEALTHY arab countries like saudi bcoz if they dont sell to the saudis the russians stand to BENEFIT

 

BY STANDING IN YOUR OWN 2 FEET, YOU OUGHT NOT TO EXPECT A FREE LUNCH

 

if we can afford to BUY & for whatever reason the US govt wont sell, its only LOGICAL to go buy from another arms supplier OR build your own & shoulder ALL the COST associated with R&D (raw materials, KNOW HOW)

Edited August 25, 2012 by dos8dos