jojoendejr Posted October 9, 2007 Share Posted October 9, 2007 what if the company still insist the argument.. what kind of evidence can they show to prove that there was an actual training... kelangan po ba may certificate or trainor....or kelangan po ba mapatunayan na proficient na.... yung employee... lets say... nde pumasa.. or something masasabi po ba natin na liable padin....or lets say na ganun na nga po ang nagyari... is this subject to criminial offense...???? or something that can damage any document that the employee have.. like NBI or Police pls help... just a hypothesis... tmany thanks po..senxa nasa pangngulit... Well, the only evidence I can think of to prove that there exists an actual training are: certificate of training, attendance sheet signed by the trained employee, contract where the employee agreed to be trained at the expense of the emplkoyer, or anything similar. These are documentary evidence. There is also such a thing as testimonial evidence where eyewitnesses may testify to prove that an actual training was done and that the subject employee (you in this case) participated. Mayroon ba? If none, then that means they have no evidence against you. If the employee was actually trained but hindi pumasa, the employer cannot force him to pay up. As I have said, training is usually for the benefit of the employer so that it will get better performance from the employee. If the employee failed, there is nothing they can do about it. The employee cannot be held liable. Walang criminal liability dito (kung hindi pumasa ang employee sa training) and consequently, no criminal offense committed. Your employment record is perfectly safe. You know, the only thing which may affect a person's record (NBI, police) is a criminal record. In your case, I can't think of any case na puwede nilang isampa. Certainly, no crime committed. Hindi rin ito magku-qualify as a labor case. Civil case (in case they want a reimbursement of the "training" expenses)? As we had seen, walang training na nangyari (assuming that what you said is what actually happened). Siguradong talo sila sa Court if they insist on filing such a thing. Quote Link to comment
hmmidontknow Posted October 9, 2007 Share Posted October 9, 2007 Well, the only evidence I can think of to prove that there exists an actual training are: certificate of training, attendance sheet signed by the trained employee, contract where the employee agreed to be trained at the expense of the emplkoyer, or anything similar. These are documentary evidence. There is also such a thing as testimonial evidence where eyewitnesses may testify to prove that an actual training was done and that the subject employee (you in this case) participated. Mayroon ba? If none, then that means they have no evidence against you. If the employee was actually trained but hindi pumasa, the employer cannot force him to pay up. As I have said, training is usually for the benefit of the employer so that it will get better performance from the employee. If the employee failed, there is nothing they can do about it. The employee cannot be held liable. Walang criminal liability dito (kung hindi pumasa ang employee sa training) and consequently, no criminal offense committed. Your employment record is perfectly safe. You know, the only thing which may affect a person's record (NBI, police) is a criminal record. In your case, I can't think of any case na puwede nilang isampa. Certainly, no crime committed. Hindi rin ito magku-qualify as a labor case. Civil case (in case they want a reimbursement of the "training" expenses)? As we had seen, walang training na nangyari (assuming that what you said is what actually happened). Siguradong talo sila sa Court if they insist on filing such a thing. i just want to make a hypothesis again... i think the only thing they can produce of is the "testimonial evidence" <--- they can do it if they want...plus there is something in my contract that i will pay the said amount.... if nag resign ako with after 1 year na maging regular ako...pero wala pong nkalagay na i ti trained nila ako... assuming that the case reinbursemnt is filed... anu pong pdeng mangyari sakin kung nde ako magbabayad?....gusto ko lng pong malaman makaka apekto po ito sa NBI and Police Records ko..madaming salamat po... good lawyer... Quote Link to comment
hmmidontknow Posted October 9, 2007 Share Posted October 9, 2007 my concern is that if its just my back pay is at stakes in here ill just let it go....but if ther's something that can affect my Document... or can put me in jail to the extent of things that they might do...cguro po gagawin ko yung dapat gawin... salmat po salahat ng mg tulong... Quote Link to comment
jojoendejr Posted October 9, 2007 Share Posted October 9, 2007 i just want to make a hypothesis again... i think the only thing they can produce of is the "testimonial evidence" <--- they can do it if they want...plus there is something in my contract that i will pay the said amount.... if nag resign ako with after 1 year na maging regular ako...pero wala pong nkalagay na i ti trained nila ako... assuming that the case reinbursemnt is filed... anu pong pdeng mangyari sakin kung nde ako magbabayad?....gusto ko lng pong malaman makaka apekto po ito sa NBI and Police Records ko..madaming salamat po... good lawyer... If that is the case, that patricular provision is null and void. Firstly, there is no training to speak of. Secondly, under labor laws, that kind of deduction si not allowed. There is such a thing as allowable deductions from an employee's salary and this includes SSS (or GSIS if u are a government employee) remittances, Philhealth, taxes, etc. Labor laws expressly enumerated such allowable deductions. The training expenses you are saying does not fdall under allowable deductions. Of course, anybody can say anything. Madali lang gumawa ng kuwento na papabor sa kumpanya ninyo. The problem is, can they back it up with solid evidence? That is the hard part. Based on what you said earlier, it would appear na there is rerally no such "training" in the strictest sense of the word. Assuming that a case is filed against you for reimbursement, that case will go nowhere. Baka ikaw pa ang mabigyan ng Court ng award for damages. One thing for sure, hindi maaapektuhan ang NBI or police record mo. Only criminal cases can affect these. That is, kung ma-convict ka of a criminal offense. Quote Link to comment
hmmidontknow Posted October 9, 2007 Share Posted October 9, 2007 If that is the case, that patricular provision is null and void. Firstly, there is no training to speak of. Secondly, under labor laws, that kind of deduction si not allowed. There is such a thing as allowable deductions from an employee's salary and this includes SSS (or GSIS if u are a government employee) remittances, Philhealth, taxes, etc. Labor laws expressly enumerated such allowable deductions. The training expenses you are saying does not fdall under allowable deductions. Of course, anybody can say anything. Madali lang gumawa ng kuwento na papabor sa kumpanya ninyo. The problem is, can they back it up with solid evidence? That is the hard part. Based on what you said earlier, it would appear na there is rerally no such "training" in the strictest sense of the word. Assuming that a case is filed against you for reimbursement, that case will go nowhere. Baka ikaw pa ang mabigyan ng Court ng award for damages. One thing for sure, hindi maaapektuhan ang NBI or police record mo. Only criminal cases can affect these. That is, kung ma-convict ka of a criminal offense. madaming salamat po master.... Quote Link to comment
webmaster_ph Posted October 9, 2007 Share Posted October 9, 2007 @fryxxter: case closed; i assume? i agree. w/o documentary evidence of the so-called "training" they'd have a hard time proving it in court. Quote Link to comment
hmmidontknow Posted October 10, 2007 Share Posted October 10, 2007 @fryxxter: case closed; i assume? i agree. w/o documentary evidence of the so-called "training" they'd have a hard time proving it in court. i certainly hope so.... anyway thanks for the sympathy sir webmaster... but im still welcoming argument in the oppsite side....i must be prepare for those kind of argument.. in the future... and do what is necessary "preventioned is better than cure..." thanks a lot good lawyers.... Quote Link to comment
webmaster_ph Posted October 10, 2007 Share Posted October 10, 2007 better prepare to get a lawyer too; just in case. Quote Link to comment
charmed shannen Posted October 10, 2007 Share Posted October 10, 2007 A lessee has not been paying her rentals for more than 8 months. Despite repeated demands by the lessor, she refused to pay her arrears. Obviously irritated by the behavior of the lessee, the lessor went to the rented premises and obtained some appliances there. Now, lessee filed a case of coercion against the lessor. But the fiscal dismissed the coercion case but instead "upgraded" the crime to "robbery with force upon things". Questions: Is the act of fiscal legal?; Can the crime of coercion be "upgraded" to robbery? What are the possible remedies available for the lessor? thanks Quote Link to comment
pogingpogi2x Posted October 10, 2007 Share Posted October 10, 2007 Sir I got problem with credit card. they gave me an amnesty program sa payment unfortunately a small amount of 3k ang di ko nabayaran. after two months sinisingil nila ako ng more than 30k total overdue daw with interest of course. I am willing to pay naman kaya lang nagrequest ako sa knila ng statement of aacount para makita ko kun pano sila nag arrive sa ganun bill. ayaw nilang magbigay dahil total overdue na nga daw un. ngayon my tumawag sakin a certain tenyente guevarra at my warrant of arrest daw ako for swindling. and pa sheriff daw proprty ko. pwede ba nilang gawin un? Sir I got same problem, sa akin naman ginamit ng kaibigan ko yung pera tapos di sya makabayad yun ang katangahan ko. tapos ang laki ng sinisingil nila at ang laki ng interest. may ground ba talaga para mag kakaso or worst makulong ka? Quote Link to comment
agentjackbauer Posted October 10, 2007 Share Posted October 10, 2007 A lessee has not been paying her rentals for more than 8 months. Despite repeated demands by the lessor, she refused to pay her arrears. Obviously irritated by the behavior of the lessee, the lessor went to the rented premises and obtained some appliances there. Now, lessee filed a case of coercion against the lessor. But the fiscal dismissed the coercion case but instead "upgraded" the crime to "robbery with force upon things". Questions: Is the act of fiscal legal?; Can the crime of coercion be "upgraded" to robbery? What are the possible remedies available for the lessor? thanks This sounds like an exam question :hypocritesmiley: (1) Is the act of the fiscal legal? Yes, he has absolute authority to downgrade or upgrade the charge for as long as the Criminal Information has not been filed with the court yet and the said upgrading or downgrading has egal and factual bases. (2) See No. 1. (3) The remedy available to the lessor with regard to the non-paying lessee is to file a Complaint for Unlawful Detainer (more popularly known as Ejectment). Needless to say, the lessor must respond to the criminal charge against him by filing a Counter-Affidavit. Quote Link to comment
webmaster_ph Posted October 10, 2007 Share Posted October 10, 2007 A lessee has not been paying her rentals for more than 8 months. Despite repeated demands by the lessor, she refused to pay her arrears. Obviously irritated by the behavior of the lessee, the lessor went to the rented premises and obtained some appliances there. Now, lessee filed a case of coercion against the lessor. But the fiscal dismissed the coercion case but instead "upgraded" the crime to "robbery with force upon things". Questions: Is the act of fiscal legal?; Can the crime of coercion be "upgraded" to robbery? What are the possible remedies available for the lessor? thanks the lessor should have ejected the lessee. this is normally stated in the contract of lease. Quote Link to comment
mlpf Posted October 10, 2007 Share Posted October 10, 2007 This sounds like an exam question :hypocritesmiley: (1) Is the act of the fiscal legal? Yes, he has absolute authority to downgrade or upgrade the charge for as long as the Criminal Information has not been filed with the court yet and the said upgrading or downgrading has legal and factual bases. (2) See No. 1. (3) The remedy available to the lessor with regard to the non-paying lessee is to file a Complaint for Unlawful Detainer (more popularly known as Ejectment). Needless to say, the lessor must respond to the criminal charge against him by filing a Counter-Affidavit. The remedy of the lessor with respect to the criminal case for Robbery (the case has already been filed in court I assume) is to either file a Motion for Reconsideration before the Prosecutor's Office or a Petition for Review before the Department of Justice. Quote Link to comment
mlpf Posted October 10, 2007 Share Posted October 10, 2007 Sir I got same problem, sa akin naman ginamit ng kaibigan ko yung pera tapos di sya makabayad yun ang katangahan ko. tapos ang laki ng sinisingil nila at ang laki ng interest. may ground ba talaga para mag kakaso or worst makulong ka? Non-payment of a loan (including credit card bills) is normally not a ground for Estafa (swindling). It is a ground for a civil case for collection of a sum of money with damages. Quote Link to comment
pogingpogi2x Posted October 11, 2007 Share Posted October 11, 2007 Non-payment of a loan (including credit card bills) is normally not a ground for Estafa (swindling). It is a ground for a civil case for collection of a sum of money with damages. Thanks Sir. Regarding sa amnesty nila may sinsabi silang breach of contract? pag di ka kc naka bayad or na late ka i-chacharge ka nila ng buo plus charges, tapos they say i should hire daw a lawyer na kung di ako makabayad. Darating ba talaga sa punto na ganon? Quote Link to comment
webmaster_ph Posted October 11, 2007 Share Posted October 11, 2007 Regarding sa amnesty nila may sinsabi silang breach of contract? pag di ka kc naka bayad or na late ka i-chacharge ka nila ng buo plus charges, tapos they say i should hire daw a lawyer na kung di ako makabayad. Darating ba talaga sa punto na ganon? could'nt you file for bankruptcy? Quote Link to comment
mlpf Posted October 11, 2007 Share Posted October 11, 2007 Thanks Sir. Regarding sa amnesty nila may sinsabi silang breach of contract? pag di ka kc naka bayad or na late ka i-chacharge ka nila ng buo plus charges, tapos they say i should hire daw a lawyer na kung di ako makabayad. Darating ba talaga sa punto na ganon? The credit card companies have a legal department. They will not hesitate to sue anyone. If you are really unable to pay due to liquidity problems, one option is for you to file for bankruptcy under the Insolvency Law. You will have to hire a lawyer to help you though. Quote Link to comment
jps0218 Posted October 11, 2007 Share Posted October 11, 2007 Hi, I'm looking for a lawyer to take this case. Its kind of urgent, although the situation outlined is specific to me and unique there are around 11 employees willing to pursue the matter regarding unpaid separation pay and more on the sidelines. We've done some research on the matter but we would like to hear the opinion of a professional, if we can setup a meeting so details can be discussed. http://manilatonight.com/index.php?showtop...p;#entry4865033 Quote Link to comment
webmaster_ph Posted October 11, 2007 Share Posted October 11, 2007 The credit card companies have a legal department. They will not hesitate to sue anyone. If you are really unable to pay due to liquidity problems, one option is for you to file for bankruptcy under the Insolvency Law. You will have to hire a lawyer to help you though. why do offer amnesty when the amount to pay is much lesser than what was owed? Quote Link to comment
MyKaeLLa Posted October 11, 2007 Share Posted October 11, 2007 I'd like to ask for advice from the good lawyers of this thread: I am currently working with Employer A and am rendering the required 30 days' notice. I have already signed a contract with Employer B, to whom I'll be transferring when my 30-day service is complete. In the middle of serving in this period, Employer A offered me a more attractive package just for me to withdraw my resignation and stay with the company. My dilemma is: if I accept Employer A's offer, will I be liable for breach of contract with Employer B? What potential backlash would I be facing? Thank you very much for your advice. Quote Link to comment
freelicker Posted October 11, 2007 Share Posted October 11, 2007 I'd like to ask for advice from the good lawyers of this thread: I am currently working with Employer A and am rendering the required 30 days' notice. I have already signed a contract with Employer B, to whom I'll be transferring when my 30-day service is complete. In the middle of serving in this period, Employer A offered me a more attractive package just for me to withdraw my resignation and stay with the company. My dilemma is: if I accept Employer A's offer, will I be liable for breach of contract with Employer B? What potential backlash would I be facing? Thank you very much for your advice. Legally, Employer B had no action against you for Breach of Contract unless you were paid a signing bonus for signing a contract with Employer B. This is because under Philippine Labor Laws, if you do not want to work for Employer B anymore in favor of another employer, you cannot be forced to do so. However, a potential backlash might be your loss of credibility with Employer B. Quote Link to comment
webmaster_ph Posted October 12, 2007 Share Posted October 12, 2007 I'd like to ask for advice from the good lawyers of this thread: I am currently working with Employer A and am rendering the required 30 days' notice. I have already signed a contract with Employer B, to whom I'll be transferring when my 30-day service is complete. In the middle of serving in this period, Employer A offered me a more attractive package just for me to withdraw my resignation and stay with the company. My dilemma is: if I accept Employer A's offer, will I be liable for breach of contract with Employer B? What potential backlash would I be facing? Thank you very much for your advice. just a sidenote: accepting counter-offers is not recommended. read here. Quote Link to comment
Borismo Posted October 13, 2007 Share Posted October 13, 2007 this seem logical... what kind of case can they file against the employee...?? and what is the worst thing that might happen aside from holding the last salary?? is this subject to criminal offense or something that can damage the record of employee in the future like NBI and Police certificate and related documents..?? thanks a lot sir Generally, your liability is just civil. Not criminal. Damage to record? Well, it wouldnt affect your NBO or Police Certificates unless the employer can cook some criminal case against you, that is totally separate from your resignation. Reputation-wise? It depends on what industry you are in. Remember the world is getting smaller, and HR managers in this country are getting more organized. I know for a fact that HR managers talk to one another, and even ask for background checks. If the HM manager dont like you guts, he will surely inform the new HR managers in your new company of your record. Not a good record to keep -- being awol. Quote Link to comment
webmaster_ph Posted October 13, 2007 Share Posted October 13, 2007 I know for a fact that HR managers talk to one another, and even ask for background checks. If the HM manager dont like you guts, he will surely inform the new HR managers in your new company of your record. Not a good record to keep -- being awol. that seems a bit going overboard. unless, the hr manager makes an oath to ruin your career. Quote Link to comment
hmmidontknow Posted October 13, 2007 Share Posted October 13, 2007 (edited) Generally, your liability is just civil. Not criminal. Damage to record? Well, it wouldnt affect your NBO or Police Certificates unless the employer can cook some criminal case against you, that is totally separate from your resignation. Reputation-wise? It depends on what industry you are in. Remember the world is getting smaller, and HR managers in this country are getting more organized. I know for a fact that HR managers talk to one another, and even ask for background checks. If the HM manager dont like you guts, he will surely inform the new HR managers in your new company of your record. Not a good record to keep -- being awol. but... but if you really are competitive enough... and the best applicant... after the compony checks your capability... any bad mouth... thrown to you by any former company is not not that important... what really matters i think is your capability to help the company to meet its goal and obejective.... reputation wise... i think netpros dont have any reputaion to look after... after all the controvertial scams... and raid by nbi...and a reputation of creating porn materials... who wants to have a commendation to this kind of company...after all im not alone... all my former TL already flew away from this company...one word to describe this company... and its "sucks" Edited October 13, 2007 by fryxxter Quote Link to comment
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