YoniMaster

Anyone here know if there’s a forum for scams from telegram?

i enjoy it when theist looks for facts and actual proper evidence when someone makes a claim against their belief but never apply them towards their own belief =)

 

i have to distance myself from the one who pointed out the claim about being peaceful or happy. coz ive actually seen a study that shows theist are happier and we atheist arent but it's still meaningless, it still doesnt mean it's real. i just stick to the purest meaning of being an atheist, non belief, that's it.

A minor reminder,

 

proving religion wrong does not prove the absence of a Creator/God since it is already known

that some religious groups were founded for the purpose amassing wealth.

 

true but it is only religion that asserts the existence of god, which if we take each and every description of any religion of their god, it is easily debunked. and what you're left with is deism, (the prime mover argument) but if as ive stated before, if we had no idea of a god and there was no such thing as religion as in the vocabulary doesnt exist given our present state of discovery and inquiry, where we never thought someone (a god) caused an earthquake, storm, tsunami or whatever natural occurence how will one discover that there is a god? hence the idea of a god will clearly fall under our concept of santa, unicorns, big foot and no one will bother with it much.

i actually think it's more for the people to feel better about having something to say to the bereaved rather than for the bereaved. i often prefer to shut up or people just shut up and just give a hearty hug and truly ask how the person is than saying things they themselves arent even sure exist (i.e. heaven) like a favorite tweet of mine from ricky gervaise reacting to celebrities posting things like sending our thoughts and prayers to the victims in oklahoma, to which he replied "i feel like an idiot now... i only sent money" https://twitter.com/rickygervais/status/336856739800571905?lang=en

However I am a bit preplexed... how does a believer of non belief cope with sadness? Depression? I mean personally, I dont know if its just psychological but there is a ceratain joy we believers find when we serve other people through our church. Not that you cant do that but there is this positive energy when we serve or attend service. So how do you cope with the test of time or destiny or whatever you call it?

nice question, i personally, don't stress that much as most people do, for most things i brush them off, for heavier things and so far i can relate only to two deaths, my gran and my fave aunt, i dont think i was more depress than than any of my family members, nor was i depress longer than most of my family that was affected. i remember clearly when my gran died i was there when they were trying to revive her, not once did it cross my mind anything about heaven or that she was in god's hands, my first words at that moment was, "lola's gone na" with a tear in my eye and a smile on my face, nothing sinister there i think you know what i mean. this was followed with the thought at least she no longer suffers. at the time i think i was 12 and wasn't really a non believer yet.

 

in contrast, when i was 5 and totally bought in to the heaven and hell crap, i remember one late night, my parents, well my dad brought my mom to the hospital, i and my sister were looking out the window crying, sobbing uncontrollably as we watch them get into a cab and drive away. i was genuinely scared that my mom would die but i remember i was more worried if she was going to hell or heaven and of course it was hell i feared. i barely remember anything from my youth and only remember sad moments, so sometimes i contrast the two happenings. i consider the incident when i was 5 as more traumatic but maybe because i was younger but i think it's still horrible to think my mom could be sent to hell, i was oblivious to her death and just worried where she would end up, meanwhile my gran dying i felt sad but relieved that she wasnt suffering anymore. so i tried coping under religion worried about hell, then one from logic, my gran felt no more pain. if i judge the level of fear i think i prefer the logical one. it doesnt escape me that as adults or maybe even kids now a days dont really buy into the heaven and helll crap which by the way kinda tells us that people dont really believe what they say they believe in otherwise we should be seeing more adults scared that they're love one is going to hell than the fact that they're dead like i did when i was young. =)

most people are apprehensive of the term atheist i simply claim to it out of convenience although i do find it does attach a lot more things to it than it should. for me all it is, is non belief. i echo the sentiments of dawkins, hitchens et. al. that since we dont have words for people who dont believe in leprechauns (a-leprechaun), fairies (a-faries) santa claus (a-santa claus) then it doesn't make sense to have the label for not believing in something that doesn't exist.

I can't agree. Because if you look at the history of religion, it is as merely as old as farming or Agriculture. It was stated that farming might have given us the the building blocks of organised religion. They manipulate nature - by praying a good harvest. It started then to develop the relationship between the man and the nature, and man to god. They pray directly to god to give them sunshine or rain.

 

Though at the end of the day, with the advanced farming technology that we have today, as far back as 10,000 years ago, we still need the sun to shine and rain to fall to produce a good harvest.

 

To make the story short, we can see now where the framework of organised religion, the priest and the church may have started from. Anyway, I seem to be getting off topic now, so I'd stop here in the meantime.

hey I don't want to assume you're a non-believer too, i am most interested on why you became one if you are a non-beliver, from this post i can tell this is one of your reasons. i might disagree a little on when religion started coz they found out, our cousins the neanderthals practice some from of religious ceremony despite being a hunter gatherer society. looking forward to reading it.

mind you the buddha didn't intend on establishing a religion and does not believe in a god, i simply stated examples that laws can be formed with out the need for god. anyway, yeah, we're not really debating, just presented things to demonstrate what i have previously stated. and how most of our laws does not come from the bible. ive also stated that religion was basically one of our first forms of government so i echo what you said i only expect our disagreement to come from whether it's man made or a god started it. =)

Good points, but I do not believe that religion impedes the development of science. Just like what they said, some people just makes religion an excuse. Lets take for instance the reproductive health bill. Of course the church will do whatever they can to stop it, just like people who believea that it should be passed. Different people, different belief, both are willing to die for that belief. Many people have died for religion, some are willing to die for that belief. I can say that an aethiest, will be willing to die that there is no God, but again if an aethiest is willing to die to prove that there is no God... Again what is the difference?

luckily i dont have to convince you, you only need to research to find out how the church considered early scientist as heretics galileo and copernicus are a very good examples already. human progress was essentially stunted for a good 1700 years, it was only in the past 300 hundred years after the reformation and the enlightenment did science truly progress. if that's not impedance then we probably have different definitions. =)

After all religion is defined as a set of belief often containing a moral code. So I take it that even aethiest follows a moral code? If you say that you follow the law of man, then bad news for you these laws are based on religion. Take for instance the 10 comandments, i think at least 6/10 is the law of men and you follow it.

nope sir phillips only 5 out of ten. we as a society have chosen to throw away 50% of what god supposedly put forth and the TOP FIVE. interestingly it's laws of how to behave toward each other none about god. futhermore if you go thru leviticus there are more laws purportedly commanded by "god" including stoning your wife, bashing a child against a stone, burning witches, persecution of homosexuals, and killing your neighbor for working on the sabbath. if you go thru our laws you can find things that may be attributed to religion but if you compare how much of it has made it today i think you'll barely find any.

 

Plus let us not forget these commandments were already in place prior to the ten commandment. the teachings of buddha for example and code of hamurabi both pre-dating not just the ten commandments but the bible. =)

 

plus remember atheism is just non belief that's it, that's the only thing atheism is about, we're not anarchist. we have to follow rules of a society, had i lived at the time id probably pretend to believe coz usually the penalty of non belief at the time was death.

The examples given relate more to religion - that is, organized doctrines, dogmas, or whatever it is religious leaders proclaim to be "what [their] God wants". It is not because of belief that there is a God, per se. Though I agree that religion, especially in this country, impedes a lot of things that lead to progress.

I am baptized roman catholic, but I cannot say that I sincerely believe all the doctrines that they preach. Mere mortals can never fully fathom what they purport to have infinite wisdom, so how can they claim to know "what God wants". There is no certainty that the God my religion worships is the true God. There is no certainty that the Gods of other religions is also the true God. It's possible that no man or religion has discovered the face of the true God.

See, I also don't discount the fact that there may be a God. This being may just not be what we conventionally conceive God to be. My philosophy professor uses the term "Transcendent" to refer to such being, as if to be religion-neutral. Some believe God is not a being at all, but is the very natural order of the universe. Whatever. I'll find out the truth for myself when I'm dead. Maybe.

i agree, specially your point of how these instituitions claim what their god want or command. but still stems out of a belief in a god they dont want to piss off. =)

I used to like debating about religion, but then I realized it doesn't matter if there is or isn't a god.

Personally I am okey with aetheist minding their own business. But aethiest who goes to the extent of spreading the word that God does not exist, I mean really, what is the difference?

i actually feel the same way but sometimes i notice how this belief affects a lot of things. i dont really care if you believe or not but do feel sad when things are impeded due to religion. not arguing with you guys nor telling you you should care but i hipe this just makes you aware how others beliefs impact you.

 

1. stem cell research- good thing the ban on this has recently been lifted by obama but it's advancement has been impeded by christian churches. fine you may say other countries have been unimpeded but the US still remains the leader in research and has more resources than other countries, how does this impact you? imagine your love one has the possibility of being healed but due to the belief in god your love one can not receive such treatment.

 

2. middle east conflict - may not be all about religion but listen to how the leaders of islamic nations call upon their faithful for the eradication of the jews not to mention wars between muslim nations they maybe far from us but conflicts that occur because they think their god promised them the same piece of realty affect global oil prices hence affects everything else in our lives.

 

3. our very own reproductive health law- strongly opposed by the church and visibly at that. fine you may not care about the poor but surely you can appreciate how a belief in god affects society. a poor couple with 12kids and this kids eating straight out of a garbage bag which we privileged few mindlessly throw out simply because a church with its doctrine are oppose to other forms of family planning.

 

4. gay marriage- only one argument i heard for this GOD! but i heard one argument about this that made me say "oo nga naman" how does it affect me? if you're against gay marriage then dont marry a gay person.

 

yup getting long again so ill stop. again gents not arguing just letting you know how an archaic belief affects you. fine probably not the gay marriage thing but just had to put that in to show how a belief in god affects peoples lives. i agree they should keep it to themselves but only if they actually did keep it to themselves theist and atheist a like but for so long as the faithful affects my life i dont really mind atheist spreading that there's no god. i actually dont unless asked.

 

so that's the difference and why it matters. =)

ive always found pascal's weak, i remember the first time this was explained to me, my knee jerk reaction was which god. not really familiar with the atheist wager but nice to know about it. oh i should say, i dont read. my choice actually came from just researching and philosophers points/arguments though interesting doesnt appeal to me. i'm actually not a fan of philosophy, it is nice to think about it but it is also where theist arguments thrive, coz religion is a philosophy with endless arguments and counter-arguments. so you might be asking the wrong person. im not well read. but i did like something i heard once from Dr. Shermer, "notice how all the proof for god are not proofs but just arguments" and einstein while debating with bohr over their argument about entanglement he said it was becoming more like philosophy than science therefore all discussions were useless. =)

oh reading back i just realized i didnt formulate a conclusion from what I've stated. well, after discovering these facts i realized religion is man made, it's an instrument of control, our first form of government, our earliest ways of understanding since we didnt know much and this made me think a bit more. thought experiment: given the advancement of technology, the internet, flood of information and such I ask myself: if we had no concept of god at all, no books no bible about any mythical character, how can one discover that there is a god? to expound further.... we discovered atoms and subatomic particles with microscopes and with particle colliders. we discovered other galaxies, super novas, our own milky way. any claim of mystery have been investigated and found to have natural causes and those undiscovered are mostly not attributed immediately to god but are extensively being researched. so if we have no idea of god how would we in this day and age discover there is one?

 

addendum: i realized stating that "we will never convince each other" makes me sound close minded but I'd like to believe I'm not, i changed my mind and i use to have strong opinions about abortion, capital punishment, drugs and i changed my mind.

Well, the moment you dip your toe in the water, there's no assurance that you can avoid confrontation since this is the venue where everyone is free to express their opinion and/or belief. There's nothing much we can do but prepare (and be equipped) with the subject matter in hand. Thank you for posting. Keep them coming.

 

yup yup, i know that, im just saying i will reflect on what they will say but will most likely not respond. in other words i dont feel like debating. of course they're free and far be it for me to stop them from sharing their opinions, i'm just saying i wont engage. rest assured though i will consider what they say for myself na nga lang. =)

Both. Bat naman naging kawawa. And why do I have this feeling na lagi mo kong nilalagay sa hotseat sir.. are you someone na kilala ko?

oo nga ma'am sitti.

is atheism under freethinking?

nope, i think the idea of freethinking is to form your own rather than being told how to think. atheism isn't necessarily under freethinking but is a result of.

the bible doesnt admit it's wrong.

my god hasnt answered my prayers, i think he's too busy giving AIDS and cancer to children. =)

The third thread and the continuation.

The 1st one had been deleted by the previous Mod due to spamming and personal attacks, same thing happened to the last one.

So I hope this will take some pages before any unfortunate happened again.

So there.

State your belief and principle, and support them if you can.

I am an atheist and was quite glad to see this page and previous pages that i didn't jump in those coz it was getting lost with what i thought was the point. so I'll stick with what the page starter had in mind (and what i wanted anyway) feel free to question, i will most unlikely try to refute you but will honestly reflect on what you say, so here goes:..

 

1. first doubts came from the bible itself, incoherent and unbelievable stories, and was simply told he's god and can do everything and anything. most atheist knows these things and probably theist but they chose to believe and i chose to doubt. circa grade school

 

2. wars between religions circa high school: of course there are many factors to whatever wars but the identifier seems to be what religion they belong to, what struck me most and baffled about was the wars between protestants and catholics. fine they have different interpretations but in essence, its the same god why fight.

 

so the first two were what planted the seeds and the following is what made it more clear to me.

 

3. existence of other religions. growing up in a catholic school wasnt really that exposed to other religions and what their religions were about. so learning about other religions baffled me. even the greek norse persian and all those that were presented as myths and i never realized that it was a religion revered the same way the religion i was born in to. so this is where the question comes "who's right" this made me an agnostic at the time, i felt like there was a god but which one?

 

4. the existence and continued growth of the numbers of christian sects. i remember when i was young being catholic and found it weird people leaving the church and joining born again or whatever protestant church. i even remember someone telling me that these churches were created by the CIA to defuse the power of the catholic church. laughable maybe but here's what i realize. in science an idea crops up and they refute each other til they finally get a more plausible answer, go with it and call it a theory and will readily dismiss that theory if a better one comes along, on the other hand in religion someone dislikes a doctrine or doesnt agree with, they try to refute and reform but instead of coming to a consensus they start their own church.

 

5. the existence of bachelor degrees, masters and doctorate in theology, plus the existence of apologist. i find it interesting that despite the existence of these higher learning it's clear there has been no progress into knowing and much less proving the existence of god. moreover, the "phrase" "you were not taught well" or that "i have a bad understanding or fundamentalist interpretation of the bible" which i find quite condescending, when you think about it there were no degrees in theology when it was written. most people who were preaching or teaching the bible didnt have degrees much less went to school and apparently they understood it better than me. all i can tell what these degrees are for are for "spin" meaning twisting the words and giving interpretations that are more coherent and less atrocious and confusing.

 

6. the bible again, but not for it's contents but it's source. no one really knows who wrote the bible, well there are a few we can confidently say was probably written by the same guy namely paul. but most are fairly anonymous. furthermore the gospels were not written by mark matthew luke or john and that some entries found in the bible were added later (check out bart ehrman watched all his debates and so far the only thing i can agree with his opponents is that the original bible is still in the bible we have just a bit polluted but still why am i taking the word of someone 2 thousand years ago who doesnt know much and easily believe in supernatural stuff and let's face it, very gullible)

 

there are more but i feel this is too long already. anyway, looking forward to what others have to say, i mean why they became atheist rather than why im wrong, yes im avoiding confrontation coz let's face it, we will never convince each other.

Im a therapist. Yeah I play. I know how to play. I flirt. Im broken. I get hurt. Minahal. Nagmahal. Yeah I exist. Im real. Duh...?! what if I told you im gonna get out of this industry soon. Very soon. Cause someone came. Making me feel na I dont belong here. Yung urge kong umalis mas intense compare before. Though. Wala pang score between the two of us. And di ko din alam if love nya ko. And di ko din alam if love ko sia he just came. Makes me feel so special. Iba. Iba talaga.. yung tipong one day pag gising ko .. nasabi ko nalang "ayoko na, di naman ako nag grogrow dito.. in fact I can feel it. Im deteriorating. " then here I am.. making decisions.. gumagawa ng moves. Sobrang hirap and nakakatakot man. Kahit baby steps man. Atleast I know im climbing my way up..

Sa lahat ng naging guests ko. Umapela na dyan if may hinuthutan, nilamangan, pinaasa, if may sinabihan ako ng ilove you ( isa lang naman sinabihan ko nun and I mean it). If may nashortchanged ako. Well im sure wala.

I care. And thats real kasi thankful ako sa financial help na binibigay nyo..and I will forever be thankful. I consider all my clients as a friend.

Reading all these.. lahat ng harsh comments. Lahat ng kung anun anung pag gegeneralization dito. Know what? It really hurts.. imagine yung ibang therapist na nakakabasa din.. how some of you call us whores. Sluts and whatsoever. If in fact pwede namang pagdebatihan tong topic na to ng mas maayos... you can tell and express naman what you feel. What you think. Kaya lang dapat ba talaga in the meanest way??

Anyways.. cool lang . have a good day fellas... hugs and kisses...!

nice =)

After a certain age d na ata talaga matanggal belly.

215 lang with a 2.0 V6

Previously 205 long time ago with a 2.0 straight 4