Antonio Trillanes: Criticism And Controversies

[darksoulriver]

 

Paulit-ulit lang tayo ah! You are trying to prove your point with your an OPINION. That may be your own interpretation of the Constitution but I am sure others have a different view.

 

check mo please lang kung may nakalagay dun Defense Secretary o can be deligated... hindi mo kailangan pa ng intrepretation.

 

parang awa mo na... wag ka nman masyadong pahalata... hahaha

[juan t]

 

check mo please lang kung may nakalagay dun Defense Secretary o can be deligated... hindi mo kailangan pa ng intrepretation.

 

parang awa mo na... wag ka nman masyadong pahalata... hahaha

 

 

Check mo rin kung nakalagay dun kelangan yung presidente mismo mag sign at hindi yung defense secretary na may authorization.

[will robie]

Anong "I knew it" ang pangasasabi mo jan? Are you talking about this OPINION of yours?

 

 

Paulit-ulit lang tayo ah! You are trying to prove your point with your an OPINION. That may be your own interpretation of the Constitution but I am sure others have a different view.

Again, how can something that is written I the Constitution be an opinion?

[will robie]

Is it? Try checking out the Constitution. Article VII Section 19. Baka mamilosopo ka at sabihin mo na sinabi ko ay "amnesty can be signed by the president" at nandun ay "the president can grant amnesty." Unahan na kita. When you grant an amnesty, it has to be documented, hence, the president is the only one who can sign the amnesty, not a defense secretary.

 

juan t, I am quoting my post again because namimilosopo ka pero sablay. Read this again and again until you understand what I am getting at.

[juan t]

juan t, I am quoting my post again because namimilosopo ka pero sablay. Read this again and again until you understand what I am getting at.

 

Ang kukulit... I understand very well what you, darksoulriver, and camiar are getting at. You guys are echoing Duterte saying that the amnesty is invalid because it is the president's signature that has to be on the certificate and no one else.

 

The Constitution states that : THE PRESIDENT SHALL HAVE THE POWER TO GRANT AMNESTY.

 

What Pnoy did (and several other presidents of the past by the way) is this:

1. He GRANTED amnesty through a proclamation. His signature is on this proclamation. In that proclamation, he tasked a committee to process the applications.

2. Gazmin signed the certificate of amnesty on behalf of Aquino. The certificate basically states something like "this is to certify that Trillanes was granted amnesty by virtue of proclamation 75 by Pres. Aquino.

 

The issue we are arguing about is number 2.

 

You are saying that Gazmin signing the certificate equates to the defense secretary being the one who granted the amnesty and not Pnoy and that would make it invalid.

 

My opinion is: that Pnoy already granted the amnesty through Proclamation 75. (satisfying Article VII Section 19 of the constitution). The certificate signed by Gazmin is only an administrative function to process the application. This document, the certificate of amnesty, did not grant Trillanes amnesty but rather it certified that he was granted amnesty

[will robie]

 

The Constitution states that : THE PRESIDENT SHALL HAVE THE POWER TO GRANT AMNESTY.

Didn't you say that this was just my opinion? Bakit biglang kabig ka ngayon?

[will robie]

The amnesty can be signed by the president only, not a defense secretary. Again, how sure are you that Calida lost it? I almost forgot. It's just your opinion so I will leave it at that.

juan t, ito ang sinabi ko. When you grant an amnesty, there has to be written explicit proof which is why I said it can be signed by the president only. Ngayong biglang kabig ka.

[will robie]

 

http://www.officialgazette.gov.ph/downloads/2018/08aug/20180831-PROC-572-RRD.pdf

It is clear as day in this proclamation by Duterte that Trillanes' amnesty should have been null and void from the start.

[juan t]

Didn't you say that this was just my opinion? Bakit biglang kabig ka ngayon?

 

No. What I said was your opinion is your insistence that only the president can sign the amnesty. I was assuming you were talking about the amnesty certificate of Trillanes kasi yun yung may signature ni Gazmin. Am I correct?

 

This is what you said:

 

.... the president is the only one who can sign the amnesty, not a defense secretary.

 

Lets be clear. When you say "the president is the only one who can sign the amnesty", what exactly are you talking about?

 

The Amnesty Proclamation? The Amnesty Certificate? The Amnesty Application? All of the above?... Be specific.

 

 

[camiar]

to Will Robie:

 

Namimilosopo lang yan. He just want to have the last say.

 

yung mga readers naman dito alam na pwned na sya.

[will robie]

 

No. What I said was your opinion is your insistence that only the president can sign the amnesty. I was assuming you were talking about the amnesty certificate of Trillanes kasi yun yung may signature ni Gazmin. Am I correct?

 

This is what you said:

 

 

Lets be clear. When you say "the president is the only one who can sign the amnesty", what exactly are you talking about?

 

The Amnesty Proclamation? The Amnesty Certificate? The Amnesty Application? All of the above?... Be specific.

 

 

Ito ba yung amnesty certificate na sinasabi mo? Because in this document, it is clear that Gazmin was usurping the powers of the president. It is clear here that it is only for the information of the president. It is supposed to be "for your approval". Gazmin could not approve the recommendations because nowhere in the Constitution does it say that the defense secretary can approve recommendations for amnesty. Only the president can grant amnesty.

 

 

 

Edited September 21, 2018 by will robie

[darksoulriver]

naumay yung mga Major Media outlet kay PressCon Man hehehe...

 

nawala syang bigla sa hotspot kasi may mga mas mahalagang event na nangyari...

[will robie]

to Will Robie:

 

Namimilosopo lang yan. He just want to have the last say.

 

yung mga readers naman dito alam na pwned na sya.

Well yes but tk41 is worse. Pwned na sa isang thread, hihirit lang para lang makalast word kahit sablay na sablay. The kind of replies that make you go "wtf!"

Edited September 21, 2018 by will robie

[haroots2]

kailangan pa bang i interpret ng SC yung kung dapat siya ang pumirma sa document na siya lang ang only approving official? Grabe naman.

[rooster69ph]

^^^ HINDI ... and honestly if it is what it is supposed to be then so be it. pero shouldn’t it be applied to all? then why single-out trililing and not include the others such as faeldon? may statement pa malacanang na all the rest dahil hindi kinuwestion eh valid. oh well alam na anong milagrong ginagawa at kung bakit.

[camiar]

^^^ HINDI ... and honestly if it is what it is supposed to be then so be it. pero shouldn’t it be applied to all? then why single-out trililing and not include the others such as faeldon? may statement pa malacanang na all the rest dahil hindi kinuwestion eh valid. oh well alam na anong milagrong ginagawa at kung bakit.

 

that's the President's executive prerogative.

 

anyway, he can grant real amnesty to the others if they ask for it.

[rooster69ph]

that's the President's executive prerogative.

 

anyway, he can grant real amnesty to the others if they ask for it.

of course ... but at least he should have the decency of voiding the amnesty of all then let everyone apply again so that he can personally sign their papers. kaso hindi diba ayun napaghahalataan ... tsk tsk tsk

[camiar]

of course ... but at least he should have the decency of voiding the amnesty of all then let everyone apply again so that he can personally sign their papers. kaso hindi diba ayun napaghahalataan ... tsk tsk tsk

Decency? Irrelevant. Trollanes doesn't deserve it.

 

Duterte stated in his press conference that what he did was a President's prerogative. Why he did it doesn't have to be explained or justified.

 

He openly said he doesn't have a problem with the others. It's a message to the others that they should not worry. Besides, other Oakwood Mutiny leaders like Maestrocampo, Faeldon, Gambala, etc... are all supportive of Duterte.

 

Nag-iisa na si Trollanes sa kagunggungan nya. It has become obvious to his former comrades that he has deteriorated into a paid political attack dog.

 

Me kakampi pa ba sya sa Senado? Di mo ba pansin, yung mga LP senators, curiously, are either quiet or otherwise neutral in their comments.

Edited September 22, 2018 by camiar

[rooster69ph]

eh kala ko ba may maling nagawa yun past admin sa processo ng pagbigay ng admin kaya void ito. nasa saligang batas pa sabi ng tards ang basehan. so prerogative din ba ng president na maging selective sa application of the law? well in this case ang nasasaad ba sa constitution is to apply as the president sees fit...whether he sees the person deserving or not? the bill of rights for example...nararapat lang ba yan sa mgadeserving lang ayon sa batas? patawa naman talaga ang tards you want to pin someone down based on the law and yet nagbubulagbulagan kayo sa pagdisregard ng law. then why not just abolish the constitution and rule by the presidents prerogative instead? ay ... yun naman ata talaga ang gusto ninyo di pa lang maisulong.

 

so if in the past may ayaw kang naging desisyon o pamamalakad ng presidente ... anong nirereklamo mo? or at the very least hindi ba nagsasaad ka ng pagkadismaya gayun alam mi naman pala may prerogative ang isang presidente?

 

kala ko presidente lang ang napaghahalataan...yun pala .... hahaha

Edited September 22, 2018 by rooster69ph

[juan t]

to Will Robie:

 

Namimilosopo lang yan. He just want to have the last say.

 

yung mga readers naman dito alam na pwned na sya.

 

Namimilosopo? Bakit, legit naman mga tanong ko ah.

 

Pawned? ... by you or Wil? Never!

[will robie]

Ito ba yung amnesty certificate na sinasabi mo? Because in this document, it is clear that Gazmin was usurping the powers of the president. It is clear here that it is only for the information of the president. It is supposed to be "for your approval". Gazmin could not approve the recommendations because nowhere in the Constitution does it say that the defense secretary can approve recommendations for amnesty. Only the president can grant amnesty.

 

 

I was asking juan t a question on whether this was an amnesty certificate because this is not an amnesty certificate. It is a clear usurpation of powers by Gazmin.

 

 

 

Edited September 23, 2018 by will robie

[juan t]

 

 

I was asking juan t a question on whether this was an amnesty certificate because this is not an amnesty certificate. It is a clear usurpation of powers by Gazmin.

 

 

No. That is not the amnesty certificate. That is just a correspondence letter to the president stating the status of the applications.

 

This is the amnesty certificate: Clearly, there is no usurpation of powers in this document.

 

It is also clear that this document did not grant Trillanes amnesty, but rather, certified that he was granted amnesty.

 

Proclamation 75 was what granted Trillanes et al. amnesty.

 

Edited September 23, 2018 by juan t

[juan t]

^^^ HINDI ... and honestly if it is what it is supposed to be then so be it. pero shouldn’t it be applied to all? then why single-out trililing and not include the others such as faeldon? may statement pa malacanang na all the rest dahil hindi kinuwestion eh valid. oh well alam na anong milagrong ginagawa at kung bakit.

 

 

Obvious naman that this attack is personal for Duterte. It is obvious that he is silencing the opposition just like Marcos before.

[rooster69ph]

Obvious naman that this attack is personal for Duterte. It is obvious that he is silencing the opposition just like Marcos before.

“He openly said he doesn't have a problem with the others. It's a message to the others that they should not worry. Besides, other Oakwood Mutiny leaders like Maestrocampo, Faeldon, Gambala, etc... are all supportive of Duterte.”

 

alam naman ng mga bayarang sipsip kay Digong ang punot-dulo ng lahat ng ito...and as expected they are just rationalizing everything in Digong’s favor.

[will robie]

No. That is not the amnesty certificate. That is just a correspondence letter to the president stating the status of the applications.

 

This is the amnesty certificate: Clearly, there is no usurpation of powers in this document.

 

It is also clear that this document did not grant Trillanes amnesty, but rather, certified that he was granted amnesty.

 

Proclamation 75 was what granted Trillanes et al. amnesty.

 

This document is just a piece of paper sans the approval of the president. What I shiowed is not a correpondence letter. It is an approval of a recommendation for amnesty which only the president can sign since he is the only one who can grant it.